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viatrain2002
07-26-2004, 11:31 PM
I have a question why pictures like this one.

http://railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=71004

get accepted into the data base when they are horribly coloured and when they are horizantally unlevel and just of terrible quality get accepted when pictures like this

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreject.php?id=33454

dont get accepted when they are of a much more unique get rejected based on the fact that they are a little dark. Still the definition of this picture is sharp. I cannot understand this, could you shed some light on the subject please

Guilford350
07-26-2004, 11:53 PM
The first picture is of rare material. Its an SD70ACe being tested. It looks slightly overexposed but overall its well lit. The second photo is dark and has foreground clutter (the car mainly, and that shrub).

viatrain2002
07-26-2004, 11:55 PM
But my picture is not rare? Honestly? the ACe is not a very rare unit anymore. There are several photos of them on the site. How many photos is there of semi finished units? This picture is much more rare then that photo of CSX4835

viatrain2002
07-27-2004, 12:04 AM
Just to clear things up, I am not trying to demean your "photo intellegence' but honestly that picture is really bad, and the picture that I took is not much better, if any. However, if we are going to play the rare game, my picture may only be a SD70M however it will never be seen again looking like it is there, and also the forground clutter is part of the shot since i am trying to show them finalize the build of the unit How can you without including the "clutter" I appologize again if I am sounding like a jerk or what have you, but sometimes the decisions of the screens leaves me in aw!

Chris Starnes
07-27-2004, 12:17 AM
Im personally in "awe" of you comparing your photo to the shot of the SD70ACE. It at least has a hint of sunlight and doesn't have any horribly distracting foreground clutter like your shot.

Thats about all I can add, Guilford covered it well already.

viatrain2002
07-27-2004, 12:36 AM
Alright so you want pictures of ACe's I can arrange that. I hope that they will be judged on the same level that that wonderful 4835 was judged on. Lets not forget that this is rare... Sorry again for sounding like a jerk. I really dont mean to be, but honestly....

viatrain2002
07-27-2004, 12:56 AM
This is just a question for everyone, excluding screeners or moderators..
Unique? Worth posting on RP?

http://www.viatrain.net/XXXXa

Joe
07-27-2004, 02:58 AM
All I think you need to do is brighten it up a bit. My pic with a car in it got accepted http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=58808 , so I say, why can't yours? I think it would be a fine photo if you brighten it up! But, if Chris screens it, I don't think you'll have much luck!

And if all you guys want is SD70ACes, we'll go find some! :roll:

Joe
07-27-2004, 02:58 AM
Whoops, posted twice.

E.M. Bell
07-27-2004, 03:27 AM
To be honest, I doubt that any screener would accpept that shot, despite what Joe thinks. From my Bi-polar, consistently unconsistent screener point of view, the image in question is to dark (not helped by the large dark area on the side of the motor), has distracting foreground clutter, and is poorly cropped (to much foreground)...shots of new power are always welcome, but just because it's new doesnt mean that they dont need to meet the requirments. I dont mean any offense to your photography, if that shot makes you happy and you got what you wanted out of it, then thats all that really matters. you asked for opinions, and now you have mine..

Warren
07-27-2004, 03:32 AM
Well if the train would have actually hit the car and the resulting fire was bright enough maybe it would have provided enough light for the photo! :twisted: j/k
However I have learned and I would never have submitted that photo. I may have tried a flash. I would have been disapointed about the photo as I was about a few I took today and didn't submit, but it is not fair in my opinion to air your complaints in the forum.

Ween
07-27-2004, 03:53 AM
Alright so you want pictures of ACe's I can arrange that. I hope that they will be judged on the same level that that wonderful 4835 was judged on. Lets not forget that this is rare... Sorry again for sounding like a jerk. I really dont mean to be, but honestly....

Dude, settle down. Your shot, while indeed rare, is too dark. Unfortunately in this hobby, you don't always have perfect conditions and your photos are not always 100% acceptable. That's the challenge. That's the fun. Besides, who knows what rare things you'll see tomorrow...

cmherndon
07-27-2004, 03:59 AM
I'll agree with Mr. Bell in that no screener will accept that shot on the account of it being WAY too dark plus the foreground clutter. I wouldn't have let that shot even see Railpictures, my own website, or even the light of day (no pun intended) for that matter. If you like it though, that's all that matters.

Second of all, a rare CSX SD70MAC? Even if it's not finished yet, it's still not exactly rare. CSX owns at least 150 of those things. That's not what I call rare. In my book, rare would be something that there are very few of and/or one of a kind. The EMD SD50S, UP #6936, and NS #4610 for example could all be considered rare. A bit off topic I know, but I felt it needed some clarification too.

E3429
07-27-2004, 08:02 AM
Shots of NS 4610 on this site-over 80 (not counting the ones where it's 'featured' in the background. Shots of B&O GM50-1. Different eras, I know, but there is such a thing as overkill. Rare is one thing, but the 4610 seems to be immune from any bad cropping issues here. Just my opinion.

Back on topic, I'd agree that the shot in question of the CSX unit is too dark and I'd have not likely submitted it.

mojo628
07-27-2004, 01:23 PM
My two cents.........

While the photo that was rejected is sharper, it is also too dark and the automobile in front doesn't help.

The original start to all this still has some merit though in my opinion.

I have a question why pictures like this one.

http://railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=71004

get accepted into the data base when they are horribly coloured and when they are horizantally unlevel and just of terrible quality get accepted.

Why was the first picture accepted? Regardless of rareness (which is a poor factor to judge on) the picture is not good. It's washed out and not very sharp. There are too many instances of older photos and so called rare power shots being accpeted for just being old and/or rare.

Rare or common power shouldn't be the determining factor. A clear subject and clear picture should be the most determining factors. Unless a photo of a train wreck in progress is caught, the quality of the photograph needs to be the first consideration.

A bad picture is still a bad picture regardless of how rare the power is or how long ago it was taken.

Chris Starnes
07-27-2004, 04:55 PM
A bad picture is still a bad picture regardless of how rare the power is or how long ago it was taken.

In theory you are correct but in real life you are not. There is no way we can turn down older (80s and before) shots of material which in most cases does not even exist anymore. These shots bring too much traffic to this website for us to be picky over details which we would likely reject a common scene or subject over.

You must also remember the medium for photographing trains back in those days isn't nearly as technically perfect as it is now. Digitizing these older shots for web-use is not as easy as someone who has only used digital cameras may think.

mojo628
07-27-2004, 07:01 PM
A bad picture is still a bad picture regardless of how rare the power is or how long ago it was taken.

In theory you are correct but in real life you are not. There is no way we can turn down older (80s and before) shots of material which in most cases does not even exist anymore. These shots bring too much traffic to this website for us to be picky over details which we would likely reject a common scene or subject over.

You must also remember the medium for photographing trains back in those days isn't nearly as technically perfect as it is now. Digitizing these older shots for web-use is not as easy as someone who has only used digital cameras may think.

Perhaps you misunderstood the intent of my statement.

People like Martin K O'Toole, Jim Munding, Mike Woodruff & Steve Schmollinger, too name a few, have outstanding photographs taken during the late 60's and early 70's. These photos were good when shot 30 years ago and are good today.

Simply accepting a photograph because it was shot 20 years or more ago or is of power that no longer operates and not taking into account whether it is a good photograph or not (focus,color,subject matter, etc.) takes away from the quality of this site in my opinion. Whether the photograph was shot with film, digital or carved in stone shouldn't be a consideration.

I stand by my original statement. A bad picture is still a bad picture regardless of how rare the power is or how long ago it was taken.

rpalmer
07-28-2004, 08:32 PM
Shots of NS 4610 on this site-over 80 (not counting the ones where it's 'featured' in the background. Shots of B&O GM50-1.

Now that you pointed that out, I'll dig up my one and only photo of the GM50, scan it and submit it !

Rob

viatrain2002
07-28-2004, 09:25 PM
I would just like to take this opportunity to thank you all for contributing to this coversation. I guess the ACe's were not rare enough concidering you rejected all 6 or so shots that I submitted. I now know that the screens accept pictures based on the "eny meny miny moe" basis. Keep up the good work guys!

Guilford350
07-28-2004, 11:45 PM
I would just like to take this opportunity to thank you all for contributing to this coversation. I guess the ACe's were not rare enough concidering you rejected all 6 or so shots that I submitted. I now know that the screens accept pictures based on the "eny meny miny moe" basis. Keep up the good work guys!

Well with that attitude I can see why. Don't take it so personally.

E.M. Bell
07-29-2004, 12:13 AM
IF you put half much effort into your photography as you do making such witty remarks aganst the site and screeners over and over and over here in the forums, then perhaps you could get somehting accpeted. I screened all of those CSX ACE shots, and stand by my rejections...bad angles, to dark, foreground clutter...shall I continue? I am sorry that you cant understand that kind of stuff will not be taken...period, at least not by me. Perhaps you might get lucky with someone else, but I highly doubt that. I could care less how rare these engines are, if the image is so dark or badly composed that you cant make out detail, then dont submit them...its that simple!! Did you try to appeal (not that it would do much good for those shots), or did you just decided to forego that and start crying here??

While your post here are always entertaining, I have had enough of them (personaly speaking)...perhaps other forums and photo sites would be better suited for your constant and pathetic atempts to draw atention to yourself by this type of thing...

Please note..these opinions are mine alone, and do not reflect or represent the opinions of the other screeners or RP in general......

viatrain2002
07-29-2004, 02:03 AM
I dont come on here to sound like an asshole, even tho I almost everytime give that impression. I know I should not take anything reject taken personally or that I should even care or what not. It is just that when I try to contribute something that I think other railfans, not railway photographers (there is a difference), would find interesting or original (like that un numbered CSX SD70M) for instance or something like that. It is just something that I want to share and I find it frustrating, especially when the perfect lighting conditions are hard to come across all the time, when I simply cannot add a picture like that. I find that unique, and I am pretty sure that a lot of people find those unique. Or when I was trying to add that unpaited with temp number boards and no primer of a CP unit was rejected because a fence was in the way, that was frustrating as well because the conditions were not going to get any better and I was simply trying to share that picture with everyone else. Again, I dont try to be an asshole, but I do come across as one quite often, I appologize for it. Honestly tho, I am not the only person who gets frustrated by some of your rulings, take campain to buy screeners new monitors for example, that person was quite frustrated with some of the rulings you guys made, and a lot of people came out about having problems getting their shots accepted. I reailze there is only, what, three of you screeners. You guys probably screen a thousand pictures a day, and probably do not want to be pestered buy people such as myself who think they have the best photos out there, but really dont. I mean a picture to me may be absolutly awsome and to another be horrible, and that is what photography is. Photography is an art and not everyone has the same taste in it. Same as music or paintings. photography is to one's own appeal, and that is that. So again I appologize for being a bother, however just to end this little comment, I personally think that you guys even being busy with all the pictures you screen should take a second look at the photo you are about to reject (and in some cases accept) and ask your self what the person was truly trying to capture and whether or not that deep down the picture is truly unique and whether or not some of those guidelines should be over looked

Ween
07-29-2004, 02:54 AM
I try to contribute something that I think other railfans, not railway photographers (there is a difference), would find interesting or original

Try this site then:

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/

They accept pretty much anything. This isn't a knock against that site or the owner, and I hate to say his site is a site for rejected Railpictures.net photos, but photos that wouldn't cut the mustard here can be displayed there. Backlit ones or dark ones can see the light of day (so to speak) on that site and you can share them with other railfans. And that site has some pretty neat features, like an interactive map with rail lines and all the places that photos have been submitted from.

The standards here are high, but it forces you to become better. Was that un-painted CSX unit rare and pretty neat to see? Yes it was. I never saw anything like that before, but that doesn't mean I want to see it here with a car parked in front of it and in bad lighting. Same with a fence in front of a loco.

If you truly wanted to share those images with others, upload them to the other site I mentioned if you know they won't make the grade here, come back on this forum, and post a thread with a link saying, "Hey, check out this shot I took. I know it's a tad dark, but it's still pretty cool and I thought you guys would enjoy it..."

Something like that. That's a heck of alot better than venting and coming off like an @$$hole. This hobby's supposed to be fun and relaxing; don't let it or others get you down...

viatrain2002
07-29-2004, 03:01 AM
Ween,

You are absolutly right. And again I appologize for being a dick ( I got a message from Chris S. telling me to stop my bickering ) I think he read my appology wrong, but anyways. Thanks for that site. You know dispite my complaining and all of that I still have a few pictures up on this site, and I am glad that all of them are up, well there are a few that I wish I could change. Anyways, I am going to check out that site.

cmherndon
07-29-2004, 03:19 AM
Three words: Get over it. Everyone gets photos rejected.

It is just that when I try to contribute something that I think other railfans, not railway photographers (there is a difference), would find interesting or original (like that un numbered CSX SD70M) for instance or something like that. It is just something that I want to share and I find it frustrating, especially when the perfect lighting conditions are hard to come across all the time, when I simply cannot add a picture like that.

Yes, there is a difference between railfans and railway photographers. I am a railfan, not a railway photographer, but I still strive for good quality shots, not something that's dark with a copius amount of foreground clutter. You have your own website. Why don't you upload your photos to it?

I find that unique, and I am pretty sure that a lot of people find those unique. Or when I was trying to add that unpaited with temp number boards and no primer of a CP unit was rejected because a fence was in the way, that was frustrating as well because the conditions were not going to get any better and I was simply trying to share that picture with everyone else.

There is a fine line between a fence being artistic and being foreground clutter. If the conditions weren't right, then why did you upload it to Railpictures, and then whine when it was rejected? If it was a roster shot, then maybe you should check out thread about roster shots. Again, you have your own website. Why don't you upload your best stuff to Railpictures, and the rest to your own site?

Honestly tho, I am not the only person who gets frustrated by some of your rulings, take campain to buy screeners new monitors for example

Your photo was dark. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. It was dark. The clutter didn't help matters much anyway. In fact, you said it yourself in this photo http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=69604 "The right light makes all the difference." It's really bad when people contradict themselves.

I reailze there is only, what, three of you screeners. You guys probably screen a thousand pictures a day, and probably do not want to be pestered buy people such as myself who think they have the best photos out there, but really dont.

Yeah, I wouldn't want to be pestered by some kid who got his feelings hurt when a few of his photos got rejected either.

I mean a picture to me may be absolutly awsome and to another be horrible, and that is what photography is. Photography is an art and not everyone has the same taste in it...photography is to one's own appeal, and that is that.

Yes, art is subjective. You and some others might enjoy dark roster shots with copius amounts of foreground clutter. However, I don't believe the masses do.

I personally think that you guys even being busy with all the pictures you screen should take a second look at the photo you are about to reject (and in some cases accept)

The photo in question doesn't need a second look.

and ask your self what the person was truly trying to capture and whether or not that deep down the picture is truly unique and whether or not some of those guidelines should be over looked

Being unique, which this photo is really not and I'll explain in a second why, is not the grounds for having a photo accepted. This one is DARK and has the aforementioned copius amount of foreground clutter. It's not a stellar shot. What were you trying to capture? Certainly not anything real unique. For instance, I could wake up tomorrow morning, drive to Corbin, Cincinnati, or Louisville and in turn probably shoot a few CSX SD70MAC's in the yards and shops at these locations. Your shot is really nothing unique. It's just a dark, cluttered shot of common power.

viatrain2002
07-29-2004, 03:26 AM
Caleb,

Have you ever been to my site? If you have you may have figured out that I do upload pictures to it. I think I am pushing 3000 or so by now, and growing on an almost daily basis

Warren
07-29-2004, 03:28 AM
This is what viatrain was really saying

"I think that all right thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired...I'm certainly not. But I'm sick and tired of being told that I am."

viatrain2002
07-29-2004, 04:16 AM
Thanks Warren for clearing that up for everyone!