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ScottoT 10-06-2017 06:01 PM

Greetings all
 
1 Attachment(s)
I'm a newly registered forum and railpictures.net user.

I've submitted a few photo's that have gotten rejected. I completely understand the idea that only the best get submitted. But what constitutes "poor image quality".

At first I submitted photo's as taken straight from my camera. Now I have figured out that some form of enhancing must be done for acceptance.

I realize this sounds as though I am being a poor sport about this, and admittedly I am a relatively new digital photographer, and am learning aspects of shooting. I'm just trying to figure out the process.

I had one photo submitted that was rejected because there was a weed alongside the track in front of a locomotive picture I had submitted, (attached) and the rejection was this:

- Backlit (Nose): The nose of the lead unit is too dark due to backlighting.
- Clutter (Foreground): The image contains unsightly clutter (fences, trees, weeds, etc.) which is either obstructing part of the train, or is large enough to detract from the overall image.

Thank you for your help.

Scott

ATSF666 10-06-2017 06:55 PM

Light on the nose means that the light you see on the side of your locomotive also needs to be at least on half of the front portion the locomotive's nose. Your shot does not have any direct sunlight on the front.

They don't like anything obstructing the locomotive's trucks. It doesn't take much to trigger this rejection.

miningcamper1 10-06-2017 07:06 PM

The shrubs alone are enough to kill this one for this site. And then you have the dark nose, the shadows, and the lean to the right. Post elsewhere or leave it in your personal collection. :(

ScottoT 10-06-2017 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ATSF666 (Post 192341)
Light on the nose means that the light you see on the side of your locomotive also needs to be at least on half of the front portion the locomotive's nose. Your shot does not have any direct sunlight on the front.

They don't like anything obstructing the locomotive's trucks. It doesn't take much to trigger this rejection.

Ok, see that makes sense. And worded in a way that even a new submitter like myself can use and make sense out of.

I may not agree with the clutter assessment but knowing that is a "vital" flaw in a photo (whether realistic or not) I can use when taking photo's for submission. I dare say there are many places where ground clutter will interfere with the trucks. I guess I'm more worried about seeing the locomotive body than the trucks...but if seeing the trucks is a priority. OK. Lesson learned.

Regarding sunlight, I guess that dusk type photo's will be rejected, as even though the sun was still high enough in the sky, there wasn't enough. The nose is partially lit and the number boards are lit enough to see them clearly. But the rules are the rules.

I can at least make sense out of things now. or Try when taking photo's

ScottoT 10-06-2017 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miningcamper1 (Post 192342)
The shrubs alone are enough to kill this one for this site. And then you have the dark nose, the shadows, and the lean to the right. Post elsewhere or leave it in your personal collection. :(

I'd REALLY LIKE to thank you for your constructive criticism. :-x

I've already stated that I am learning about not only using my camera but about the process involved with submitting acceptable photo's.

miningcamper1 10-06-2017 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottoT (Post 192346)
I'd REALLY LIKE to thank you for your constructive criticism. :-x

I've already stated that I am learning about not only using my camera but about the process involved with submitting acceptable photo's.

Sorry you didn't like the reply.

Would you prefer "Don't take a photo in poor light with a shrub in front of the pilot plow."?

Learning what will fly here will come with time. Or you can read previous forum threads which cover just about any conceivable rejection reason.

ScottoT 10-06-2017 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miningcamper1 (Post 192347)
Sorry you didn't like the reply.

Would you prefer "Don't take a photo in poor light with a shrub in front of the pilot plow."?

Learning what will fly here will come with time. Or you can read previous comment threads which cover just about any conceivable rejection reason.

The reply came across as "your s&^t isn't nearly good enough to be seen with my superior photographs". Very elitist instead of giving constructive advise.

And yes I would have preferred hearing "a shrub in front of the plow" will get a photo rejected!! At least that is something tangible that I can understand.

Maybe I am far too simple-minded in my thinking but what makes this photo "poor light". I've seen plenty of photos including some of yours that have been published with glare in windows, or shadows across part of the nose. Just as what you are saying is so horribly wrong with mine. Yours were accepted, mine was not.

I had other photographs submitted and rejected with grey skies, and given this rejection comment: - Lighting (Cloudy): Cloudy day shots of common/standard power, as well as cloudy images of common/standard angles and scenes, are generally not accepted."

As I have said previously, the judgments of photograph submissions seems to vary greatly, and that is causing my confusion as to what is acceptable or not.

I am in no way shape or form suggesting that my photos are suburb but the lines seem to be blurred. When someone new to the site is asking questions about why or how....photo's are accepted or rejected.

miningcamper1 10-06-2017 10:36 PM

A big part of success here is knowing what admin doesn't like- and the list is rather a long one. And since the screeners are human, they are not 100% consistent.

Chase Gunnoe wrote a helpful guide to what this site likes and doesn't like. http://www.therailroadcollection.com...ginners-guide/

BTW, I said nothing about my own photos here. I post them here and on Flickr, and let them "speak" for themselves.

Decapod401 10-07-2017 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottoT (Post 192348)
The reply came across as "your s&^t isn't nearly good enough to be seen with my superior photographs". Very elitist instead of giving constructive advise.

And yes I would have preferred hearing "a shrub in front of the plow" will get a photo rejected!! At least that is something tangible that I can understand.

Maybe I am far too simple-minded in my thinking but what makes this photo "poor light". I've seen plenty of photos including some of yours that have been published with glare in windows, or shadows across part of the nose. Just as what you are saying is so horribly wrong with mine. Yours were accepted, mine was not.

I had other photographs submitted and rejected with grey skies, and given this rejection comment: - Lighting (Cloudy): Cloudy day shots of common/standard power, as well as cloudy images of common/standard angles and scenes, are generally not accepted."

As I have said previously, the judgments of photograph submissions seems to vary greatly, and that is causing my confusion as to what is acceptable or not.

I am in no way shape or form suggesting that my photos are suburb but the lines seem to be blurred. When someone new to the site is asking questions about why or how....photo's are accepted or rejected.

It sounds like you are not only new to the site, but also relatively new to the hobby. Some of the questions that you are asking have to do with what I would consider "rookie mistakes", and need to be understood and overcome before understanding how to get accepted by RP. Obstructions in front of the lead locomotive is something that I learned to avoid 40 years before I ever submitted a photo to RP. I would not recommend RP as a primary goal while you're in the early learning stage.

Before I ever submitted a photo here, I read a lot of forum posts, including a thread that had over 2000 posts calling out accepted photos. It was basically a continual rant about screener inconsistency, and was eventually deleted by admin. It was, however a great way to see what was considered unacceptable by RP standards.

If you intend to use RP as a learning tool, read the beginner's guide (link below) and some of the forum threads dealing with rejections. My recommendation is to wait until after you have absorbed this material before submitting again. Then go back and look at your own photos with a very critical eye, and only submit photos that have no flaws that you can see. You will still get rejections (we all do), but you will improve your percentages. If you submit photos to simply learn how to take better images, you will find RP and its forums a very frustrating place.

Rule #1 is that criticisms are about your photograph, not about you. If you ask for advice, the people here on the forums will be brutally honest, but honesty will help your photography, as long as you don't let emotions get in the way.




Quote:

Originally Posted by miningcamper1 (Post 192349)

Chase Gunnoe wrote a helpful guide to what this site likes and doesn't like. I don't recall where it is, but perhaps another member can post the location.


http://forums.railpictures.net/showthread.php?t=11436

KevinM 10-07-2017 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Decapod401 (Post 192350)
If you ask for advice, the people here on the forums will be brutally honest, but honesty will help your photography, as long as you don't let emotions get in the way.

I always try to be honest with people, but I try to never be brutal. :)

Decapod401 10-07-2017 02:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinM (Post 192351)
I always try to be honest with people, but I try to never be brutal. :)

I should have said that they will be honest, some brutally so. That said, the forums are a much kinder, gentler place than they were a few years ago.

nikos1 10-07-2017 03:42 AM

If you're mad about this shot getting rejected you're gonna have a bad time....
This is literally a basket case of every rejection available.
Obstructions: Get used to pulling up weeds trackside, you may look stupid doing it but its worth the effort.
Lighting: RP wants all visible sides of the train lit, in this case there is maybe 1/4 of the front of the train lit, this can work but the angle has to deemphasize the not lit side.
Shadows: locomotive half in and half out of shadows is a pretty much instant reject.
Composition: train is cut off ackwardly, unless going for a roster shot try to find a way to naturally cut off the train or show enough of it that the cut off isnt as noticeable.

SAR Connecta 10-07-2017 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottoT (Post 192348)
The reply came across as "your s&^t isn't nearly good enough to be seen with my superior photographs". Very elitist instead of giving constructive advise.

And yes I would have preferred hearing "a shrub in front of the plow" will get a photo rejected!! At least that is something tangible that I can understand.

Maybe I am far too simple-minded in my thinking but what makes this photo "poor light". I've seen plenty of photos including some of yours that have been published with glare in windows, or shadows across part of the nose. Just as what you are saying is so horribly wrong with mine. Yours were accepted, mine was not.

I had other photographs submitted and rejected with grey skies, and given this rejection comment: - Lighting (Cloudy): Cloudy day shots of common/standard power, as well as cloudy images of common/standard angles and scenes, are generally not accepted."

As I have said previously, the judgments of photograph submissions seems to vary greatly, and that is causing my confusion as to what is acceptable or not.

I am in no way shape or form suggesting that my photos are suburb but the lines seem to be blurred. When someone new to the site is asking questions about why or how....photo's are accepted or rejected.

All the chaps who have commented above and given you some direction on getting started here at RP are spot on - they do this regularly and freely! Look, learn, listen and read up as much as you can with the older forum posts. Spend time studying the accepted photos in the database as often as you can - find some photographers you would like to aspire to even and follow them. In doing so you will get a grip on things and your photos will improve greatly.

ScottoT 10-08-2017 06:14 PM

Thanks everyone. I truly do appreciate your comments and input.

ScottoT 10-08-2017 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miningcamper1 (Post 192349)
A big part of success here is knowing what admin doesn't like- and the list is rather a long one. And since the screeners are human, they are not 100% consistent.

Chase Gunnoe wrote a helpful guide to what this site likes and doesn't like. http://www.therailroadcollection.com...ginners-guide/

BTW, I said nothing about my own photos here. I post them here and on Flickr, and let them "speak" for themselves.

I apologize for taking offense to your first comment and I would like to offer up a most sincere and humble apology.

My intention to get clarification on some of the terms and reasons used by the screeners will be a learning curve, and I took the comments personally instead of using them as an honest critique.

So please miningcamper1. I hope you and others here will give me another opportunity and accept this apology from a humbled beginner.

Regards
Scott

ShortlinesUSA 10-08-2017 10:38 PM

Another thing I've noticed which hasn't been brought up-- both the Lake State and CSX trains you posted here do not have headlights on and appear to be parked. Shots that do not convey any sort of action and appear parked (whether they are or not) are often not accepted unless submitted as an individual roster shot of a locomotive.

You've gotten a lot of good advice from some highly experienced photographers. Keep working at it; you'll get there.

CSX1702 10-08-2017 10:52 PM

RP rejections and reading these forums helped my photography tremendously. I challenged myself for years to get better and it took awhile but I got there. I am grateful to these "brutal" folks for that.

One thing I can say is, while RP will help, stay true to yourself. Take pictures that YOU like. RP helped me figure out how to do that by learning fundamentals and new techniques.

Noct Foamer 10-09-2017 01:56 AM

The engine was parked, so you had a lot of time. I often stomp down any weeds like that, or cut them with either my Swiss Army knife or a folding saw. The other problem was the direction of the light. I've come to think that recognizing Light is the most important skill a photographer can develop. It takes some time. The second most important skill is Previsualization--the ability to visualize how a photo will turn out before you take it. That one wasn't really a factor here as the subject was stationary. Looking at your photo, the engine is interesting and I like the colors. I assume this was shot in late evening? The photo probably would have worked if you had cut the weeds and taken it in the morning, when the sun would have been coming from the opposite direction? On an overcast day (or at night) you don't have to worry about the sun's direction.

To learn, what I suggest you start doing is looking at photos you really like and begin analyzing them. What direction was the Light coming from? What kind of light was it? How did the photographer compose and balance the photo? How were lines used? And finally, did you get a feel of what it was like to be there from the photo? (see my photo below.)

https://www.flickr.com/photos/968260...posted-public/


Kent in SD

CSX1702 10-09-2017 04:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noct Foamer (Post 192366)
.. I've come to think that recognizing Light is the most important skill a photographer can develop... The second most important skill is Previsualization--the ability to visualize how a photo will turn out before you take it.

...To learn, what I suggest you start doing is looking at photos you really like and begin analyzing them.

More advice that has been a huge help. Another thing that I had learned from someone on here (can't remember who) was "Don't just show me the train, show me a scene."

miningcamper1 10-09-2017 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShortlinesUSA (Post 192363)
Another thing I've noticed which hasn't been brought up-- both the Lake State and CSX trains you posted here do not have headlights on and appear to be parked.

Why let unlighted headlights or burned-out bulbs be a problem? They are easily turned on in post. :twisted::twisted::twisted:

[Exception: when the lamps would be casting a glow or beam outward, the glow is difficult to do convincingly.]

ScottoT 10-10-2017 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miningcamper1 (Post 192370)
Why let unlighted headlights or burned-out bulbs be a problem? They are easily turned on in post. :twisted::twisted::twisted:

[Exception: when the lamps would be casting a glow or beam outward, the glow is difficult to do convincingly.]

I can't even get weeds and shadows right yet, now I have to turn the lights on too?? :lol:

Noct Foamer 10-10-2017 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottoT (Post 192371)
I can't even get weeds and shadows right yet, now I have to turn the lights on too?? :lol:


Well, if they left the engine door unlocked it might be easier to just slip inside and flip them on. Just be sure to turn them back off when you leave.:wink:


Kent in SD

ShortlinesUSA 10-10-2017 07:33 PM

I was going to suggest taking a page out of the "Couple of Guys from New Jersey Who Came to Town and Ruined it for Everybody Else" manual, but you beat me to it!

miningcamper1 10-10-2017 08:25 PM

If a headlight should have been on, I see nothing wrong with correcting the situation. :-)

troy12n 10-11-2017 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottoT (Post 192346)
I'd REALLY LIKE to thank you for your constructive criticism. :-x

I've already stated that I am learning about not only using my camera but about the process involved with submitting acceptable photo's.

You won't really get much out of this website if you can't take criticism...

Your response comes off real snarky which will rub a lot of people the wrong way. The person you replied to gave an honest, constructive criticism.

You don't have to agree with it, but it's true.

I would not have been so nice with my criticisms, but he got to it first and I don't feel like beating this dead horse tonight


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