Old 01-26-2007, 05:38 PM   #1
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Default 3 shots, 3 rejections..opinions wanted

Hi,

Well with the opinions of many looking through the forum and photos, I'm looking for several on these photos below. I am looking for potential flaws in my post processing as well as some doubts as to the ability of my D50 to perform compared to other models and makes used here. In my quest to try to find different angles and twists to generate continued interest, the rejection notes below make me wonder how I could improve my execution before any post processing takes place.

The first one is of a undersharpened picture and one I took on a tripod using a telephoto. One question I have regarding the focal point in the camera setting, is the "single area or dynamic area" preferred most or all the time? Any variable I can eliminate will be less headaches for me . I take the time to look at others similar and wonder how severe is the difference to get the rejection?


http://www.railpictures.net/viewreject.php?id=330959

The next one is of bad cropping, how would you crop to make it correct in the eyes of the screeners?

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreject.php?id=330944

Last one is of "bad motive" and in some out of the box thinking, I wanted to show people just how long trains can be using some obvious structures as well as the snake like visual of the train hugging the river edge. What type of ideas to you have on the interest in this thought process and how you'd tackle to shot?

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreject.php?id=330752

As always, thoughts appreciated with a better product the goal!

Rich Clark
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Old 01-26-2007, 05:53 PM   #2
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I don't know about the first one, but I have ideas on the second and third.

For the second and third shots, it's not easily apparent that the photographs are of trains. The second one has way too much mountain in it. I know what you're trying to do with it, but there's really too much dead space above it.

The third one looks like it's a photograph of the coal plant. That's where your attention is being drawn to. Again, I know what you're trying to do. But the train is just too far away to make out.
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Old 01-26-2007, 06:01 PM   #3
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On the first one, not much you can do about that since it was nailed for poor image quality. It's hard to fix an image with low quality like that one and make it better with PS or any program for that matter.
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Old 01-27-2007, 03:37 AM   #4
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How can you make it correct in the eyes of the screeners?

Hmmm...

I truly hope you haven't fallen into the pitfall that so many do when they visit this site. Shoot for yourself first. If a shot makes it great. If not, oh well.

Unfortunately, there are many out there (including on this forum from what I've read while lurking) that seem to think this site is THE authority on rail photography. It is not even close. It is a great site and a useful one, but RP is not the gospel of railroad photography.

Ask the cheerleaders though, they'll probably tell you different.
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Old 01-27-2007, 04:05 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTony
How can you make it correct in the eyes of the screeners?
You've lost the point and theme of photography IMO when you think like this.
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Old 01-27-2007, 04:07 AM   #6
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BigTony is pretty outspoken for a fifth post ever. Some of his statements are well taken, but why they needed to be made now is unclear. This forum is mostly about getting help with pictures for submission to RP. It also serves as more broader guidance, in my view. I think most people here are broader minded, yet take advantage of what the RP experience offers as far as photo criticism on a technical, non-artistic level. SOAPBOX OFF!

I will trust Rich to be an adult and decide for himself what his photography is about. Here are some opinions on the shots:

1) low quality: I would have guessed oversharpening as there are some wierd artifacts. It is also possible that you weren't as steady on the tripod as you would have liked. Is the tripod really sturdy, or a cheapo? What was the shutter speed? Is it a quality lens? For a shot like this, I would implicate lens, tripod, and technique, not the body.

2) I like it! I like the theme of big, big mountain, small, small train, and it's a rich color of brown. However, one can get rid of some dead space, right side and bottom. Doing so has the side benefit of making a subtle repositioning of the train so the space in front of it exceeds the space behind it, making it more entering the frame than exiting, generally desirable. If it doesn't get accepted, enjoy it for yourself.

3) It's not a train, zero chance here. You have the basics of wide-angle landscape photography down, have something close in the foreground to contrast with the distance. However, it isn't a pretty scene, really, and it is really difficult to tell what the long band it - I presume it's a train. It might work much better on a pretty summer day with color in the vegetation.
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Old 01-27-2007, 04:09 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Christopher Muller
You've lost the point and theme of photography IMO when you think like this.
I think he was picking on what he perceives, rightly or wrongly, to be Rich's view.
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Old 01-27-2007, 04:17 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC
BigTony is pretty outspoken for a fifth post ever. Some of his statements are well taken, but why they needed to be made now is unclear. This forum is mostly about getting help with pictures for submission to RP. It also serves as more broader guidance, in my view. I think most people here are broader minded, yet take advantage of what the RP experience offers as far as photo criticism on a technical, non-artistic level. SOAPBOX OFF!
Really, I could have picked any thread in this particular section of the forum. Not saying it is the case with this member here, but a majority of folks who post in this section (from what I've read over the past few months) seem to display the very attitude I as referring to.

But hey, I'm not insulting anyone, a person is entitled to their free choices. I just find it odd the views that so many take of this site.

As for being outspoken, its a byproduct of my upbringing.

Last edited by BigTony; 01-27-2007 at 04:21 AM.
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Old 01-27-2007, 04:46 AM   #9
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One of the continuing sources of entertainment here is trying to interprete the screener's reasons for rejecting a picture. It would be a whole lot simpler to have a category something like "Screener simply doesn't like it".

The first image is interesting, and I can't really think of a reason for rejecting it other than it just doesn't work for me. Probably poor composition would come closest. And I would agree with the comment above that if anything it is oversharpened, although not badly.

The second picture is simply too much mountain and too little train. Given the right kind of lighting, it could work, if the sun highlighted the train and perhaps perhaps put some brightness into the folage on the hill. I would say not so much a cropping issue as a poor lighting issue.

The third picture.....well, when you have to use the caption to explain where the train is you should recognize you're in trouble from the git go. As somebody else said, it's a picture of a powerplant, and not a particularly interesting one at that.

Well, all that negative stuff said, none of of the pictures were awful, and the camera seems to give pretty good images. Your challenge is simply to keep at it and learn as you go. Heck, everything I said above could apply to the pix I took when I first started out.

John
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Old 01-27-2007, 05:02 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John West
Your challenge is simply to keep at it and learn as you go.
There's the rub.
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Old 01-27-2007, 05:11 AM   #11
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I'll pretty much agree with John West here, Rich.

Photo #1 seems "oversharpened" - almost looks embossed.
Play around with your sharpening techniques (sharpening and undersharpening if you have such a setting). There are many - many - tips on sharpening photos on RP and on the Web - just type "sharpening or undersharpen" on Google and read on.

Photo #2 in my own opinion is very nicely cropped. Sometimes such a wide angle can diminish the emphasis on the subject, so tightening the view may prove more visually appearing - to some. Like John stated, with the right sun and angle, the photo would probably have worked just fine.

And I'll concur also, live this and learn - if it suits you, you've accomplished much. Also, a truism on RP - sometimes a particular screener simply doesn't like a particular shot. Clean it up and and if the quality can be improved, you may get it in on an appeal.

Photo #3 - Like others have stated - looks like a pic of a power plant. A well worded discription /caption would go along way here but in the end, the train is very hard to distinquish, there is little detail and I personally like to atleast see the engine or, uh, caboose.

Keep at it!

/Mitch


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Old 01-27-2007, 02:56 PM   #12
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Let me start off by stating there is no offense taken.

I want to thank the people for their comments and for the record, I take pictures for me first and if they make it here on RP then that is a plus. My reasoning behind starting this thread as well as others in the past is to gain more knowledge and techniques that could better suit my photographs.

A few of the shots I will work on and will appeal as having one in my own album is nice but being able to share shots of certain geographic spots, trains and weather conditions is more rewarding to me. Sometimes my biggest frustration of a rejected shot is the fact that since we all have opinions, a good quality shot may never see the eyes of many interested people if it doesn't get by the ones of a screener/s. That being said, many shots do not deserve that chance and the one I tried to show the winding length of a train going around the coal plant is one of those after thinking of the comments on here. The shot will come in handy in making a train layout and building certain scenes though .

Bottom line, I drove for 500 plus miles, was up for 22 hours and had a great day in the area of the shots in question. It was a bit better in the fact the forecast was for flurries and snow showers and I saw sun for a good part of the day until a few clouds played games with me and the tempurature was great.

Thanks, Rich Clark
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Old 01-28-2007, 01:29 AM   #13
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I have a D70 and regularly create quality 30x40 prints with very little post processing, and your camera should do the same, since it has the same 6.1 MegaPixel resolution.

Ensure that your images are captured at the best quality available, such as LARGE/FINE or even RAW, and the lowest ISO that suits the scene to eliminate grain.

Good luck!
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Old 01-29-2007, 11:30 AM   #14
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Hi all,

I might just chime in here with a couple of my suggestions as I think most of the observations have been covered already by other's with the exception of you know who.

Photo 1: Possible cause for the soft image could be slow shutter speed or large aperture keep an eye on both when setting up the shot. The Image quality of most lens's improves dramatically one or two stops from wide open.

Photo 2: Try this in the Fall the colours of the trees should add some interest. Possible cropping a little of the bottom could improve the current image.

Photo 3: Hmmm perhaps try a 3/4 wedgie shot (I cant believe I just suggested that ) from the front of the train with the rest trailing around the curves back in to the distance.

Cheers,

Christine
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Old 01-29-2007, 01:52 PM   #15
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How's this? The third shot is the best of the three and the one least likely to get into the database. Again, good photograph, but the train is just too small.

Going backwards, the second shot doesn't woork for me BECAUSE of the tunnel, which is hard to make out exactly what it is from the shot. When I have to read the caption to get an idea of what I'm looking at, I begin to wonder why exactly I'm looking at it.

Shot one has something going on that I don't really get. The reject is for soft sharpening, but then someone said it looks too sharp. To me, it looks like the focus is off on the train, but that the water to the left of the train is tack sharp.

It also looks like a spot where a train coming toward you would work better, but the view is interesting. The only other bit of advice I'd offer is that the train may need to move further up in the frame to really work well. I would go back to the original on this one and start from scratch.


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