Old 11-25-2006, 11:10 PM   #1
andy buckley
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Default Bad Motive - but what counts as Railway Equipment?

Hi folks, I'm new to this and I hope you don't mind me joining in.

After having had three pictures accepted and then a string of rejections, I thought I would give up. But then I found the Forums and I'm really glad I did!

I've been reading and re-reading many of the posts and trying to follow the reasoning behind the advice given and tried to apply it to some of those submissions I've had rejected.

However, there do seem to be anomolies in what is and isn't accepted on RP. I've had a string of 'bad motives' and I wonder if I could share a couple of pictures for advice.

One of my reasons for recording the railway scene is not only a historical record, but a picture that may be of help to someone who can't get to the scene themselves - perhaps a modeller or someone with a special interest. To my mind it doesn't necessarily have to include a train or loco to be of interest - seeing pictures of padlocks recently on RP show that this can be the case.

Here's a picture of a signal box I took near Lincoln in the UK. It's interesting (to me at least) as there are very few all-wood constructed signal boxes left in the UK - this one is of Great Northern Railway origin and I think quite interesting architecturally - I've set it in the scene to which it relates (a junction) - over to you....



Grateful for any comments

andyb
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Old 11-26-2006, 02:05 AM   #2
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Andy, welcome to RP.net! Please dont let the rejections discourage you. We've all had many-a-reject from the Admins. It happens to the best of us. And I enjoy seeing non-American trains and what not.

One problem with the picture below is that its not focused enough on the tower. If the shot is of the tower, then get closer and get a better shot. Another issues is that nothing cool is happening in the shot. The sky is that horrid gray (that Im all too familiar with living in the Pacific Northwest) that we all loathe. And there is really no known subject. That would be a wicked shot if it had a train either coming or going around one of the corners. Also theres a nifty little box at the bottom of the upload page to explain your "photographic intent" to the Admins.

If possible, go back to that location and try and retake the shot but with more emphasis on the tower or put a nice train in the shot. Its a really neat looking tower, the architecture is quite interesting.

Nice steam shots btw! Good luck with your shots and feel free to post here in RP.net forumland!
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Old 11-26-2006, 10:32 AM   #3
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Thanks you for the welcome Mike! and thank you also for your comments.
One of the problems with getting 'closer' to the signal box is that to do so one would be trespassing on railway property. I'm actually stood on a level crossing to get that picture. Moving to the right is not an option because of some large trees but moving to the left gives us this view:

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/andy.bu...holmes_tea.JPG

(Note the labelling of the 100t tanker - I was considering offering this as a visual gag - you know how much we English like our tea!)

The more you move to the left the further you move away from the signal box because of the River Witham - here's an image I had rejected for poor lighting to illustrate...

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreject.php?id=310195

you lose the signal box but I think this may have possibilities with reflections in the water - what do you think?

andyb

Last edited by andy buckley; 11-26-2006 at 12:13 PM.
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Old 11-26-2006, 02:43 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SD70MACMAN
Im now on JetPhotos.net! FRIGGIN' SWEET!!!
Only because they were taken beside the railroad track, being transported by rail!
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Old 11-26-2006, 05:20 PM   #5
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Andy,

That's one of those really tough locations that looks neat, but is hard to get a picture out of. One thought would be to try standing on a short step ladder to shoot over the bridge railings. Also, try and get a train coming around the curve toward the signal box. I've attached a sketch showing two possible photo positions, one showing a bit of the river and bridge, but probably having the railing obstruct part of the signal box. The other would be taken from just outside the tracks, but it may not be possible to stand there with a train actually coming.

Michael Allen
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Old 11-26-2006, 08:17 PM   #6
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Good luck as you work on this location. I want to reinforce what SD70MACMAN said about the lighting. You've got a problem with that in all of the pix. Returning in good weather is the only solution, of course. Well, maybe you can also try a telephoto lens or crop heavily. The sky is your enemy. Maybe also a ladder, from the TEA train location, to reduce the effects of the railing. Also, what is the compass direction here, where does the sun rise and set?

BTW, I love tea! Maybe because my parents lived in London for over a decade? I use heaps of light cream; I understand the British way is with lots of milk or cream, and I attribute my tastes to that. I presume TEA is an acronym of some sort?

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Old 11-26-2006, 09:36 PM   #7
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Many thanks to Michael for drawing out those diagrams. I like the idea of the stepladder but this also reminded me of a stepladder of a bigger kind. Below is the view from the same spot in exactly the opposite direction with the TEA train passing the next signal box (Lincoln High Street) and another level crossing only about 400 yards away. Of possible help is a multiple storey car park - I don't know if it's public or private but if public this may offer birds eye view possibilities - both directions look interesting.... btw the rails run almost due East-West at this point.


re J's comment "I presume TEA is an acronym of some sort?" Your'e right - TEA is TOPS code for this type of tanker: for those that are interested
TOPS (Total Operations Processing System) is the computerised coding system used in the UK to classify wagon types.
Usually nmade up of four letters - the first three are carried on the wagon label - with all four held on the computer.
The first character identifies the vehicle type. Examples are:

A - passenger carrying coaching stock
F - Flat wagons
H - Hopper wagons
M - Mineral wagons
T - private owner tank wagons
etc

The second character identifies a subset of type

The third character identifies the braking system (vaccuum/air/combination/hand or just piped)

A is air braked only so our TEA wagons are T. private owner tank; E. bogie 102 tonne glw; A. air braked only.

Hope this helps?

andyb
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Old 11-26-2006, 09:37 PM   #8
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Oops - a stray post - how embarrassing - how can I get rid of this? Hellp!!

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Old 11-27-2006, 08:08 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Callufrax
Only because they were taken beside the railroad track, being transported by rail!
Hey...shut up

Sexy blades in that shot above.

Interesting acronym useage on the Brits cars. Useful spotting feature. And I thought you guys just drank a lot of tea.

For Christmas, Im asking for a tea set for my dorm. Its for the long, cold Pullman nights...
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Old 11-27-2006, 04:35 PM   #10
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Hi Andy,

Good to have somebody else from (not so) sunny Bedfordshire on here.

AFAIK the car park at Lincoln is a public one, seem to recollect parking there many years ago, but I don't remember taking any pictures from within. It would probably require a bit of walking round and trying the views from different levels, best of luck and I hope that the sun shines next time that you are there.
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Old 11-27-2006, 05:38 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC
Good luck as you work on this location. I want to reinforce what SD70MACMAN said about the lighting. You've got a problem with that in all of the pix. Returning in good weather is the only solution, of course. Well, maybe you can also try a telephoto lens or crop heavily. The sky is your enemy.
J
I found a similarly motived picture on RP net where apparently there's nothing happening... http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=143011 - so if I was to 'colour' the sky with a pale blue gradation would that increase my chances?

I actually believe that the even illumination of 8/8ths cloud-diffused lighting gives a better picture and that shadows would actually detract from the detail... if you were to have a look at many Rail Company official photos of ex-works locos and property (engine sheds for example) you will find that most if not all were taken on 'cloudy' days - anyone else have any thoughts on this? (although I do realise this is rather academic and not likely to get my shot acceptance rate increased.... )

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Old 11-27-2006, 09:00 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andy buckley
I found a similarly motived picture on RP net where apparently there's nothing happening... http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=143011 - so if I was to 'colour' the sky with a pale blue gradation would that increase my chances?
Well, besides the fact that coloring sky is against the RP rules and is difficult to pull off (because the non-sky parts of the picture look like it's a cloudy day, but the sky is blue), the link is to a picture that, while undated, appears to be a historical picture, for which standards at RP appear to be much looser.
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Old 11-27-2006, 09:06 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andy buckley
I actually believe that the even illumination of 8/8ths cloud-diffused lighting gives a better picture and that shadows would actually detract from the detail... if you were to have a look at many Rail Company official photos of ex-works locos and property (engine sheds for example) you will find that most if not all were taken on 'cloudy' days - anyone else have any thoughts on this? (although I do realise this is rather academic and not likely to get my shot acceptance rate increased.... )

andy b
I don't disagree. Nonetheless, I suspect that the chances of a photo with blah lighting and oodles of white/gray sky being accepted are pretty low. Flat lighting has it's purpose - I've read that outdoor portraiture is often quite effectively done on bright overcast days because of the diffuse light - but if does not lead to some level of artistic or interesting light, I don't think it will be accepted here. Not just because of RP, but because such shots are viewed by many (hey, I didn't actually take a poll! ) to be dull/mundane unless the subject is quite interesting, and makes for a great photo no matter the sky.

The purpose of "official photos" is not great photography, it is documentation. Flat lighting allows for a mid-day shot that captures detail.
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Old 11-27-2006, 11:42 PM   #14
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Quote:
I hope that the sun shines next time that you are there.
Thank you Janet - I was due to go to Lincoln on a Christmas shopping trip last w/e but the 'storm' Friday night put paid to that.

btw I note that there is a steam railtour with BR Class 8P Pacific 71000 'Duke of Gloucester' to visit Lincoln on 8th December. It would be an opportunity to combine an interesting setting with a unique and therefore very interesting train - perhaps I ought to go and camp out in that car park and book my space soonest... of course it's bound to be cloudy....

JRMDC -
Quote:
The purpose of "official photos" is not great photography, it is documentation.
- you are correct - but personally that is my main reason for taking photos - I don't class myself as a great - nay, not even a good - photographer - if I get an acceptable (in RP.Net terms) shot then that's more luck than judgement - but I plan to work on that with inspiration from the great contributions on RP.net - so thank you everyone for the discussion and contributions here.

andyb

Last edited by andy buckley; 11-28-2006 at 01:10 AM.
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Old 11-28-2006, 03:12 AM   #15
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Andy,

Two of the prime rules for shooting when it's cloudy are to shoot close and shoot down, so your car park idea might work. You would keep the sky out of the picture that way. Diffuse lighting helps to show detail, but you should keep the sky out of the photo. Also, most of those works photos are in Black & White!

On the steam tour, I'd shoot from the river bank and try and include the bridge. Try shooting from a step ladder for that shot. Which way will the steamer be going, left to right or right to left? Right to left would allow you to shoot with the signal box in front of the loco. Left to right would be best more head on if you want to include the signal box, unless you just want the top of the signal box showing above the train.

Anyway, best of luck!

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Old 11-29-2006, 07:25 PM   #16
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Quote:
Which way will the steamer be going, left to right or right to left?
It'll be coming left to right - so might have to forget the signal box altogether as it may be obscured by what comes out of the stack. It looks like I'm going to have to miss it at Linclon after all; but it will be passing within 1/4 mile of my house up the East Coast Main Line on it's way north so might be able to get a shot if the sun's up...

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Old 12-02-2006, 04:03 AM   #17
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Andy,

Hope you got a shot somewhere.

Also, you mentioned you got three shots in, then a string of rejections. How about submitting your avatar photo? It's very good.

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Old 12-03-2006, 12:45 AM   #18
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Quote:
Also, you mentioned you got three shots in, then a string of rejections. How about submitting your avatar photo? It's very good.
Thanks for the kind comment Michael - I did but it was rejected

I think I'm doomed...
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