Old 04-21-2014, 04:06 PM   #1
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Default What do YOU want from Railpictures?

Gentlemen,

Throughout the past few days, I've enjoyed reading the ongoing Railpictures vs. Flickr discussion. The thread has generated some very thoughtful insight and some intelligent points of view. I'm glad to see a diverse group sharing their opinions on their advantages to alternative photo sharing outlets.

As I've shared many times before, when I originally came to Railpictures many years ago, I knew very few people within this hobby and I certainly didn't know anything about railroad photography. Through developing friendships in the form of interaction in this very forum and learning the ways of the screening process, I slowly developed some photography skills. I didn't learn to shoot exclusively for Railpictures and their screening standards, but I learned basic photography techniques through rejections given. Was I frustrated? Did I occasionally bitch in the forums? Did the thought cross my mind to leave the website and never return? Yes.

Inspiring your creativity:
Railpictures inspired some of my creativity. I was constantly looking to push the envelope of creativity or detail trough abstract photography or out of the box PEQ-destined efforts. Was that process frustrating? In a sense, yes. When the efforts were acknowledged with an acceptance, it was rewarding and it inspired me to continue with new efforts. Do the screeners appreciate out of the box material and abstract details? Yes! We encourage and enjoy nice railroad photography.

Interaction & Photography Mentoring:
While I rarely interacted with administration on this website during my earliest years, I would correct my rejections, re-submit, and learn from the mistakes. I felt this was a form of interaction, but in a subtle online digital way. It provided a photographer almost instant feedback on his/her photography that didn't cost him/her anything. It helped me to develop photography skills and find myself in an environment that would ultimately influence my college path and career field. Through some of my most frustrating rejections, I still processed it as a learning curve and I was committed to continue learning and improving.

I firmly believe that the interaction through rejections is a great way for young aspiring photographers to develop skills, interact with others, and receive helpful constructive criticism. As observed in the RP vs. Flickr discussion, the lack of flexible daily uploads makes its difficult and discouraging to correct mistakes and receive feedback efficiency. Perhaps this is something that can be discussed through administration...

Competitiveness:
I've always enjoyed the SC, POTW, and PCA awards. It's a unique concept that is exclusive to RP in the railroad photography genre. It sparks some form of competitiveness, but in a fun and enjoyable way. And, it's a cool way to see what images our contributors enjoy the most. We have an extraordinary amount of talent on this website. I'm disappointed to see that some of that talent has quietly walked away... Others have walked away, but not so subtly....

I think that for some of our well known adult photographers who know plenty about railroad photography are most offended and discouraged by the screening process. It's the simple bad color/contrast rejections or soft/oversharpened that can create controversy and ultimately discourage that contributor from submitting. It's disappointing. As I explained earlier, we enjoy nice railroad photography and I personally enjoy the older scans that represent a much cooler era of railroading. Unfortunately, sometimes the images need just very very minor processing corrections (such as color/ sharpness, etc.). Whether than correcting, sometimes that will result in the contributor just walking away...

Let's focus on the title of this thread... What do you want to see from Railpictures and what would make your invested time in this website more worthwhile? Another primary complaint often discussed is the lack of administrative interaction.

The entire staff works full time at jobs that are completely unrelated to the website. I would like to make a conscious effort to interact more with our contributors, answer questions, and provide additional insight when possible.

This site continues to be a great outlet for railroad photography that you cannot receive elsewhere. Community interaction, great search functions, high quality railroad photography, and a very globally diverse railroad photo collection. It's all contributor fed... And I know I speak for the entire staff when I say that we appreciate your support and involvement with the website.

Best,
Chase Gunnoe
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Old 04-21-2014, 05:28 PM   #2
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In my own personal opinion, the only thing I can think of off the top of my head would be to see photos open in a modal/pop-up window rather than a new browser page/tab.

Admittedly there were times when I first started joined here that I was frustrated with rejections that, at the time, I didn't understand. The screening process helped me become a better photographer overall. While I know some don't agree with it, I'm appreciative for it. I enjoy looking at quality photos and this is the site I prefer to do just that. I've enjoyed it for years and hope to continue enjoying it long into the future.
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Old 04-21-2014, 05:37 PM   #3
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I like the site. As you said, Chase, it has the unique piece of competition which is friendly, but constructive at the same time. I began submitting photos at some point in 2009 and didn't get my first on until 2011. During those two years I honestly took the rejections to heart and worked to correct all the things that weren't generally preferred in a professional photo scene.

I felt that accomplishment when you guys FINALLY accepted one of my photos and I guess I still feel that when I get one on now.

For me, the site works as it is. Some little things like the color being a wee bit off or the sharpness being slightly off can irk me, but you guys have standards, and I don't get what's so impossible to understand about that. Keep doing what you're doing. That being said, when a photo gets rejected I no longer try to resubmit it as I won't edit my photo for the liking of someone else.

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Old 04-21-2014, 05:45 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chase55671 View Post
Let's focus on the title of this thread... What do you want to see from Railpictures and what would make your invested time in this website more worthwhile? Another primary complaint often discussed is the lack of administrative interaction.

The entire staff works full time at jobs that are completely unrelated to the website. I would like to make a conscious effort to interact more with our contributors, answer questions, and provide additional insight when possible.

This site continues to be a great outlet for railroad photography that you cannot receive elsewhere. Community interaction, great search functions, high quality railroad photography, and a very globally diverse railroad photo collection. It's all contributor fed... And I know I speak for the entire staff when I say that we appreciate your support and involvement with the website.

Best,
Chase Gunnoe
In no particular order:

- Mitch has established two threads, I think, that record lots of nuts and bolts suggestions from lots of people

- I don't think the "appreciation" you speak of takes a necessary additional step. Staff should consider "walking in our shoes", for lack of a better term. Staff's perception of the website may not match that of users.

- Photography is subjective. Screening seems not to always recognize that. Screeners should be more flexible in evaluating shots that were not done the way the screener might have done it.

- Separate from that is inconsistency. I think I am more tolerant of that than many regulars in this forum, I think I realize just how hard that can be. At the same time, improvements can be made. Part of that is related to my previous point - just because the screener doesn't personally like what was done, that doesn't mean it is not a show worthy of the database.

- Admin should try harder to modify the screening process to reduce the extent of having series of rejection, fix one thing, hit with a rejection for another reason. That is a KILLER issue here, in my view, because of the frustration factor. It is a lot easier to upload a good shot and have it rejected because of differences in preferences, right at the start, then to have the process go on and on.

- if I may play amateur psychologist for a moment , screeners should think deeply about how much the screening process results in better photographs vs just being personal preferences. Photography is subjective. Perhaps step back and question how much value is provided in screening, for photos of a certain general quality level. I can understand rejecting trash, but there are lots of shots where the screening isn't actually resulting in "better", it is simply narrowing the range of acceptable.

I could write more, that is enough for now...

good luck on improving RP
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Old 04-21-2014, 06:35 PM   #5
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If a screener rejects a photo for whatever reason, when it gets resubmitted, it should be screened again by the original screener. This would eliminate what is perceived as "screener inconsistency" in a lot of re-submissions and "killer" rejections showing up after the third or fourth re-submission. Thanks for starting this thread Chase! Hopefully it has the desired effect.
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Old 04-21-2014, 09:52 PM   #6
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Wink Preliminary Questions

Before I respond, I would ask the screeners as a group, and those that actually own the Web Site, this:

What is the purpose of this Web Site?

Is it to maintain a searchable data base for RR, and RR related photos?

Is it to establish a site where hobbyists can share RR photos with friends and acquaintances on the WWW?

Is it to show off RR photos ya'all like?

Or, is there some other purpose?

And:

Does web traffic on a particular photo, or photos make any difference with regard to the site's ability to support itself with ads?

Or in simplest terms, would you (the Site owners) rather have photos viewed 354 times, or 1,500 times and greater?


It seems to me that photos with high view numbers would be more indicative of the stated purpose of the Site, which is stated as the desire to show "the best RR photos on the Internet."

* * *

BTW - I don't mean to be argumentative, such information would help in the discussion.

I await your response.

Thank you.

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Old 04-21-2014, 11:07 PM   #7
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1. Any applicable rejection should be applied the FIRST time the photo is submitted. You shouldn't get a bad cropping, then fix that, then get some nonsense like PEQ or high sun. If it deserves a PEQ or high sun on the second submission, it most certainly deserved it on the first submission.

2. There should be a "resubmit" button when reviewing rejections, so you can resubmit that photo without having to type in all the photo info again

3. For people with 1 or 2 submissions per day, you should be able to resubmit one of those photos an unlimited number of times per day.

4. Consistency in screening

5. Pop-Ups / Ads: this isnt the 1990's...
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Old 04-22-2014, 12:10 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC View Post
- Admin should try harder to modify the screening process to reduce the extent of having series of rejection, fix one thing, hit with a rejection for another reason. That is a KILLER issue here, in my view, because of the frustration factor. It is a lot easier to upload a good shot and have it rejected because of differences in preferences, right at the start, then to have the process go on and on.
First off Chase, I appreciate the post and the reaching out to us this way.

This problem, which JRMDC mentioned and Troy and Carl reiterated is to me the most frustrating part of the screening process and the one most in need of improvement. For those of us with limited slots per day, there is nothing more frustrating than getting a bad cropping, fixing that, getting bad contrast and fixing that...... and then getting a PEQ or some other killer rejection. Sometimes 5 or 6 minor rejections, and then a killer rejection. Yes, different screeners with different viewpoints, etc., but as I've mentioned in other posts, it would save both screeners and photographers a lot of time if killer rejections are given earlier, or maybe if there is a way for resubmissions being screened only based on the previous rejection (i.e. is the cropping better now? yes or no) and not screening from scratch for every resubmission.
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Old 04-22-2014, 01:34 AM   #9
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What do I want? Some consistency in the screening would be nice, as would a re-tooling of the rejection reasons and how they're used. I believe it's already been said that it would be nice if the screeners took a little bit of a "look longer & harder" approach at some shots before accepting/rejecting them. In the recent past, plenty of quality images have been rejected that had much more of a place here than some of the garbage that has, somehow, made it through the process.
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Old 04-22-2014, 02:16 AM   #10
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I greatly appreciate what RP has done for me. With digital photography in general and RP in particular, I have become the shooter I am today.

I think the screening process is the CORE of this site. Without it, this place would be chaos and would filled with the "Best Drivel On The Net!"

That being said, trivial rejections are the worst. I would say this is the main reason that accomplished photographers are leaving.

After the rejection issue, I would have to say the site is dated and needs a refresh. I think that people, such as myself have become bored with the site want something new.

Obviously, this is not the internet of 10 years ago. The screening of the comments and the emails that were a good idea in the '90's are now old fashioned since they slow the overall site interaction. The internet of today is instant and waiting for snail mail like responses is a little silly.

This is the Facebook era and RP must catch up.
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:38 AM   #11
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5. Pop-Ups / Ads: this isnt the 1990's...
Troy, I hate to disagree with royalty such as yourself, but I have Firefox and Adblock Plus and I have never seen an ad or pop up on RP. Just sayin'.....
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Old 04-22-2014, 03:47 AM   #12
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MAKE AN APP! Flickr has one... Search function needs to be integrated with picture info... hard to find anything when it only searches captions. Figure out a way to update the cities... Superior, WI has thousands of pictures on this site... shouldnt need to manually add it everytime. Stop allowing people to edit my info without my permission...you all have full time jobs not related to the site, get new people. Its fine that you have lives but if you aren't able to maintain the site properly then find people who can. The old adage applies... Sh** or get off the pot. Most of your contributors work full time jobs and still find time to railfan and edit pictures and contribute to this site...
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I personally have had a problem with those trying to tell us to turn railroad photography into an "art form." It's fine for them to do so, I welcome it in fact, but what I do have a problem with is that the practitioners of the more "arty" shots, I have found, tend to look down their nose's at others who are shooting more "mundane" shots.
Railroad photography is what you make of it, but one way is not "better" than another, IMHO. Unless you have a pole right thought the nose of the engine! -SG
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Old 04-22-2014, 04:23 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC View Post
In no particular order:
- Photography is subjective. Screening seems not to always recognize that. Screeners should be more flexible in evaluating shots that were not done the way the screener might have done it.

- if I may play amateur psychologist for a moment , screeners should think deeply about how much the screening process results in better photographs vs just being personal preferences. Photography is subjective. Perhaps step back and question how much value is provided in screening, for photos of a certain general quality level. I can understand rejecting trash, but there are lots of shots where the screening isn't actually resulting in "better", it is simply narrowing the range of acceptable.

I could write more, that is enough for now...

good luck on improving RP
I appreciate your insight, J and am glad to see your contributions both in this forum and on the site. I am vaguely familiar with those threads created by Mitch, but in an effort to better follow suggestions, I felt that an entirely new thread would be most effective.

Subjectivity on RP has been an ongoing debate for a long time... When concerning abstract photos or new and creative efforts, I always try to give a photo every chance of being accepted. Creativity is encouraged as long as it's somewhat consistent, relevant, and technically correct, it'll be accepted. When screening oddball and out of the box scenes, I think that introduces the most amount of subjectivity.

The rest of the submissions are more or less by the book. With hundreds of photos each day, it's very easy to detect bad composition, color, cropping, etc. when you're reviewing many images on a daily basis. Subjectivity doesn't play a role in images that are being judged for technical standards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mberry View Post
First off Chase, I appreciate the post and the reaching out to us this way.

This problem, which JRMDC mentioned and Troy and Carl reiterated is to me the most frustrating part of the screening process and the one most in need of improvement. For those of us with limited slots per day, there is nothing more frustrating than getting a bad cropping, fixing that, getting bad contrast and fixing that...... and then getting a PEQ or some other killer rejection. Sometimes 5 or 6 minor rejections, and then a killer rejection. Yes, different screeners with different viewpoints, etc., but as I've mentioned in other posts, it would save both screeners and photographers a lot of time if killer rejections are given earlier, or maybe if there is a way for resubmissions being screened only based on the previous rejection (i.e. is the cropping better now? yes or no) and not screening from scratch for every resubmission.
Hi Michael, thanks for your input. I do understand how limited slots per day can discourage one from making corrections and resubmitting those corrections efficiently. It slows down the learning aspect of the website and can be frustrating, too. I think that as a photographer displays respect and the willingness to learn, those daily upload limits can be increased without the necessity of an elite membership. In many cases, administration has selectively increased daily upload limits of photographers who express genuine interest in learning.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis A. Livesey View Post
That being said, trivial rejections are the worst. I would say this is the main reason that accomplished photographers are leaving.

After the rejection issue, I would have to say the site is dated and needs a refresh. I think that people, such as myself have become bored with the site want something new.

Obviously, this is not the internet of 10 years ago. The screening of the comments and the emails that were a good idea in the '90's are now old fashioned since they slow the overall site interaction. The internet of today is instant and waiting for snail mail like responses is a little silly.

This is the Facebook era and RP must catch up.
Hi Dennis, good to hear from you, too! I think Railpictures was in desperate need of a facelift many years ago. The redesign of the website and the introduction of new features has drastically increased the appearance of the website in my eyes.

Additionally, we're more involved today in social media than ever before. I think the interaction through social media has helped us reach out to the community as well as promote our database and its most popular photos.

Keep the comments rolling! While I didn't address everyone, I'm very appreciative of the insight and am taking notes on everyone's recommendations.

Thanks,
Chase
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Old 04-22-2014, 04:43 AM   #14
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Like Dennis - I too have a debt of gratitude to pay to RP for providing the resources to become a better photographer. Unfortunately, it's greatest resource to me was not so much the screening, but the crowd it attracted - I learned much from many talented photographers who have since found other venues to share both their work and insight.

What do I want from RP?

Pretend RP is a BUSINESS and treat patrons like customers you actually want to attract, maintain and perhaps even recapture.

Here's a start:
http://marketing.about.com/od/relati.../crmtopten.htm

As Janusz stated - yes, I created two threads under "Site Related" that could make the experience more enjoyable /valuable in regards to fixes and suggestions. They start with an * to make them easier to find.

Consistency seems to be the main issue. There are just way too many instances of rejected images identical to previously accepted images. Screeners should get together and try to be more in sync - you don't have to like a shot to approve its inclusion into the database. I'd rather see more perceived "bad" stuff get in then risk losing some "high risk good stuff". The site is much more a database then a site for spectacular photography. Don't read me wrong - some of the absolute best photos (AND PHOTOGRAPHERS) can be found on RP (past and present) but wrecks, Darwin's, and news shots put an emphasis on "Database". Yet, even with all that and roster shots too, there is still not one site easier to navigate and easily pull what you are looking for from within the depths of the deep.

One observation I've made in regards to FLICKR - while RP might be home to the easiest to find Best Railroad Photography on the Net, FLICKR is home to the Best (bookmarked) Photographers on the Net. In that respect, though quite a long shot, I'd love to see RP invade FLICKR's space. I'd rather see Jim Thias's, Dennis Livesey's, INDECLINE's and Gary Pancovage's perceived "mediocre and off kilt" photos included in RP then the 80% of what gets in daily. Is there no way to "earn" admittance to such a club? It's in no way exclusionary as it only retains the perceived best photographers rather then excluding others. It's not as if there are only 25 slots per day nor is it like a PEQ /poorly cropped "Eric Williams" photo will trump a better photo from another photographer. Screening would still be mandatory (after all, we all miss some things some times), but perhaps appeals can be fast tracked and more tolerant. After all, how does a business treat it's best customers? And by best, I mean the regulars in addition to the perceived stars (base it on something - average views per image, PC's, published success (Ron Flanary, the Danneman's, ect) - what ever).

My 2 - after all, I still have a dog in this fight.

/Mitch

PS - I disagree with the concept of requiring a screener to list each and every reason for a rejection. With upwards of 75 images rejected daily, do the screeners really need to be pushed that far? Fix it, note so in comments to the screener and move on fingers crossed for the next screening. Find some screeners that still LOVE doing what they do, while your at it - noted in my suggestions thread.

Last edited by Mgoldman; 04-22-2014 at 06:56 AM.
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:22 AM   #15
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Subjectivity on RP has been an ongoing debate for a long time... When concerning abstract photos or new and creative efforts, I always try to give a photo every chance of being accepted. Creativity is encouraged as long as it's somewhat consistent, relevant, and technically correct, it'll be accepted. When screening oddball and out of the box scenes, I think that introduces the most amount of subjectivity.
I suggest you be more conscious of your use of the word "somewhat" as at times the standards here are muck pickier than that.

In general, my focus on subjectivity is perhaps less directly stated than it should be. So let me try again. Because photography is subjective, screeners shouldn't be so g*dd*mn certain that their requests result in an improved image. And if they don't result in an improved image, they should not be requested! My view is that, too often, they do not.

I wonder sometimes if, in RPs zeal to fix the bad stuff - a successful effort! - RP loses track that maybe the same screening "eye" is inappropriate for, in particular, the better than ok stuff.

Quote:
The rest of the submissions are more or less by the book. With hundreds of photos each day, it's very easy to detect bad composition, color, cropping, etc. when you're reviewing many images on a daily basis. Subjectivity doesn't play a role in images that are being judged for technical standards.
You might be surprised about "doesn't play a role". Think about that again, and consider the possibility that you are wrong. The range of "by the book" is narrower than you think. There is a range of shot quality where the shot is pretty darn good and RP is too picky in that range.


Quote:
In many cases, administration has selectively increased daily upload limits of photographers who express genuine interest in learning.
How does one express that genuine interest? How does one communicate with admin, regarding that or any other issue? Heck, I have repeatedly seen people having no idea why they lost their upload count. Communication with admin is not always successful. We see complaints about that regularly.

For starters, how about a clear and stated policy about what it takes to loose uploads and what it takes to get them back. At times RP in that dimension in particular seems to be a black hole.
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:54 AM   #16
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I have been at two uploads a day for as long as I can remember and Im probably running at about a 4% rejection rate, or about 2 every 50 shots.
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I personally have had a problem with those trying to tell us to turn railroad photography into an "art form." It's fine for them to do so, I welcome it in fact, but what I do have a problem with is that the practitioners of the more "arty" shots, I have found, tend to look down their nose's at others who are shooting more "mundane" shots.
Railroad photography is what you make of it, but one way is not "better" than another, IMHO. Unless you have a pole right thought the nose of the engine! -SG
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Old 04-22-2014, 06:21 AM   #17
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First, I guess, I would like to see some of these suggestions acted on. Every now and again a thread is started with suggestions or a question/complaint ( see Mitch's lists or for the latter any thread started with "upload limit") and there never seems to be any input from the Admins or any corrections, changes, additions, or answers made to the questions or the suggestions. I would guess most of all have full time jobs as well and still find time to contribute to the site so I think that excuse is poor.

Secondly, fix some of the rejections to make this easier. Bad color, Bad contrast come to mind. And horizon unlevel. Add to that initial rejection and say which way. If you go to a restaurant and order a steak and it's not to your liking you don't send it back and say well maybe cook it more or maybe a little less.

Third, Stay involved and participate in this site. We do. Too many sounds of nothing but crickets and nothing more from Admins and screeners.

I'll never understand the screening process fully ( nor do I want too) but take a little person preference out of it maybe. Cloudy/Common and the PEQ come to mind. The "screener roulette" phrase is common in the forums.

And finally, GOOD LUCK with this little endeavor. I hope some good and positive things come out of it.
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Old 04-22-2014, 10:57 AM   #18
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What do I want from RP?

Pretend RP is a BUSINESS and treat patrons like customers you actually want to attract, maintain and perhaps even recapture.

Here's a start:
http://marketing.about.com/od/relati.../crmtopten.htm
You would think the site owners would be out in front of this, not Chase. I think that speaks volumes about the situation.

Maybe they tasked Chase to do this, since maybe they feel he is closer to "us" than they are. Or maybe he just cares more.

Quote:
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PS - I disagree with the concept of requiring a screener to list each and every reason for a rejection. With upwards of 75 images rejected daily, do the screeners really need to be pushed that far? Fix it, note so in comments to the screener and move on fingers crossed for the next screening. Find some screeners that still LOVE doing what they do, while your at it - noted in my suggestions thread.
Gonna disagree with you there. I dont think its that much to ask
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Old 04-22-2014, 01:32 PM   #19
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Two reasons why I find flickr to be an easier platform for viewing photos are: 1. I can look through all of a photographer's full size images by just hitting the right arrow key opposed to having to individually click on each one. 2. on my small screen laptop, when photographers upload larger images to RP, the image is far to large for my screen. Meanwhile, when viewing images on a much larger monitor, anything on RP seems very small. Flickr allows much larger images to be uploaded than RP, yet automatically adjusts their size displayed according to the size of the monitor being used to view them.

That being said, from my perspective RP is the best exclusively railroad related photo site, with screening being the primary reason for that. I think the rejection process is often difficult to understand or get used to, because it's quite unique when compared to most places looking for high-ish quality rail photos (that I've encountered at least). Magazines and books often want 100% unedited photos, and could care less about cropping / contrast / color, because they like the image and want control over editing themselves. Meanwhile, they will reject tons of photos with no reasons given. On RP, it's quite common to get a photo rejected numerous times, only to watch it be extremely popular with the site's viewers when accepted. When that's happened to me, I usually think the rejections were appropriate and I ended up with a better looking image in the end, but considering that prior to its acceptance, I was told "bad" this "bad" that, only to have it be one of the top shots of the day / week / month, it can be confusing, though obviously something I'm used to by now.
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Last edited by ME 488; 04-22-2014 at 05:54 PM.
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Old 04-22-2014, 09:24 PM   #20
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Lightbulb Still Waiting for Answers Guys.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by ME 488 View Post
......... On RP, it's quite common to get a photo rejected numerous times, only to watch it be extremely popular with the site's viewers when accepted.
Hence my question(s) as to the purpose of the Site.

Just about all of my most popular shots were rejected as PEQ and I played screener roulette - quite successfully I might add.

For instance some examples:

Image © EL ROCO Photography
PhotoID: 321327
Photograph © EL ROCO Photography


Image © EL ROCO Photography
PhotoID: 472059
Photograph © EL ROCO Photography


Image © EL ROCO Photography
PhotoID: 324321
Photograph © EL ROCO Photography


Image © EL ROCO Photography
PhotoID: 471906
Photograph © EL ROCO Photography


Image © EL ROCO Photography
PhotoID: 447804
Photograph © EL ROCO Photography



My question about the purpose of the Site was in reference with my experience in uploading the Carrizo Gorge shots.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/367221...7642088881223/

Initially RP was luke warm into taking these shots, however they seemed to loosen up after most of them were very well received view wise (all but 2 were top 4 of 24).

I can explain some of the trepidation based on the fact that I am walking all over the tracks which I normally never do with an active track.



I did however point out that the tracks in the gorge have been closed since 2008, and there is no date set when they might again become active.


After the embargo explanation, uploads were being accepted and then at some point they just PEQ'd all the additional ones without explanation.

I even asked for some direction through an appeal - that if ya'all were done with gorge shots, just let me know so I don't waste everyone's time, but nothing.

It was kooky because people were contacting me by email and asking why I had quit uploading Carrizo images.

Seems the vast number of non-uploaders who view these pictures have no clue that I can't just put up anything I want.

Additionally, they have no clue about the grief process and the creative editing that goes on.

So I quit uploading Carizzo & Ferrum shots to RP and directed people to my Flickr page instead.

As a result, the emails stopped and my Flickr numbers went through the roof.

Does RP not want that traffic?


Quote:
Originally Posted by ME 488 View Post
........I usually think the rejections were appropriate and I ended up with a better looking image in the end.

Yes, and on occasion that has happened in the past and I ended up with something that perhaps I didn't see initially, but as time went on I just resubmitted the same image and it got in.

Last edited by Holloran Grade; 04-23-2014 at 05:38 AM.
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Old 04-22-2014, 10:36 PM   #21
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Chase's words: "Subjectivity doesn't play a role in images that are being judged for technical standards."

Don't kid yourself, RP has no 'technical standards.' When you have technical standards, a rejection for bad contrast or unsharp image, bad color, etc. is going to be the same, screener to screener.

Did I hear someone say 'inconsistent?'

There has been a science of photography for as long as there has been photography. Eastman Kodak was a leader during the film/chemical era, and I'm sure there are computer types and physicists who apply impartial measurements to digital images today.

Why not find out what those measurable standards are, and adopt them? You could even devise software to screen and reject photos that don't make the grade before a screener ever lays eyes on them. The added benefit would be reducing screeners' workload, giving them more time to evaluate photos on their visual merits.

Last edited by BobE; 04-22-2014 at 10:43 PM.
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Old 04-22-2014, 10:38 PM   #22
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Quote:
"Subjectivity doesn't play a role in images that are being judged for technical standards."
Don't kid yourself, RP has no 'technical standards.' When you have technical standards, a rejection for bad contrast or unsharp image, bad color, etc. is going to be the same, screener to screener.

Did I hear someone say 'inconsistent?'

There has been a science of photography for as long as there has been photography. Eastman Kodak was a leader during the film/chemical era, and I'm sure there are computer types and physicists who apply impartial measurements to digital images today.

Why not find out what those measurable standards are, and adopt them? You could even devise software to screen and reject photos that don't make the grade before a screener ever lays eyes on them. The added benefit would be reducing screeners' workload, giving them more time to evaluate photos on their visual merits.
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Old 04-22-2014, 10:43 PM   #23
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Posted twice in error. Sorry
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Old 04-22-2014, 11:00 PM   #24
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First I'd like to say I'm new on RP and I'm still learning how the whole site work and whats expected. I'm also grateful we have this forum as a great resource tool. I have submitted dozens of photos only to be rejected over and over again as I see I'm not alone. I will also admit in the beginning I got pretty frustrated with the rejections. Mainly as some have mentioned the screening process to which you fix one thing only to get hit with another. Also it would be nice if the screeners rejection was more in depth maybe even suggesting needs more light or contrast etc. Since were at the mercy of the screeners it would be nice to know what there looking for after the rejection. feel this would save the screeners time and upload bandwith also.

One thing I would like to see is ability to resubmit a rejected photo without having to wait to the next day. I understand the upload limit for the day but if you already uploaded a photo and it was rejected I think as long as it the same photo but fixed, you shouldn't have to wait.
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:25 AM   #25
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One of my big issues is the inconsistent screening. Although everyone has pretty much hit the nail on the head. It does get frustrating to see a shot get rejected for being soft, and then in the same screening process have a shot from another photographer that is clearly out of focus get in the database moments later.

Even though Chase answered my thought in his initial post. I would like to see more Staff interaction. Even dropping a line once and a while to remind every one they exist. Instead of coming around when the forums start boiling over the edges every couple of months.
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