Old 03-21-2006, 05:42 AM   #1
WilliamDiehl
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Default Heat Distortion=BullS$IT???

I hate to be acting like a cry baby...but I just got my first "heat distortion" Rejection...I find this to be a bull reason to reject photos, this is almost as hard as getting rid of the train itself...but to add to more insult to injury (no offense to Pat) but the nearly same shot was uploaded, and wasaccepted...

Mine http://www.railpictures.net/viewreject.php?id=226548

versus

Pat's http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=137691

again...no offense Pat...
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Old 03-21-2006, 06:06 AM   #2
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Quote:
but the nearly same shot was uploaded, and wasaccepted...
Which means you probably shouldn't worry about it...being similar shots and all.
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Old 03-21-2006, 06:13 AM   #3
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I have other shots that were rejected for the same reason also though...while using a telephoto lens, it's hard to not get that effect...it's kinda like trying to take a picture of a train without a train....
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Old 03-21-2006, 10:57 AM   #4
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Actually, I like your composition better. Was the other submitted first?

Never heard of heat distortion rejection. I want to see the train, not what is growing on the mountain behind the train

Without the heat distortion, you couldn't tell if the train was in motion. The distortion shows that it is working hard.

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Old 03-21-2006, 11:25 AM   #5
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I think the heat distortion of the locomotives and first few cars are what they are talking about, not exhaust fumes. I think the heat distortion looks pretty cool, especially on the part of the train in the background. It seems the only way to eliminate it on the locomotives would be to get closer.
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Old 03-21-2006, 12:06 PM   #6
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Default Consider this.

Given the choice between yours and Pat's, I would have sided with the screeners on this one.

Pat captured more scenery, but he also lucked out and did not get nearly the amount of distortion you did on the rest of the train. The heat waves appear to have dissipated enough that you can at least somewhat clearly see the trailers. Probably a result of a more conservative focal length than your photo, which looks to me like you went as far as the lens would allow.

On yours, while being a railfan, I know what he's carrying. If I were not very familiar with railroading, It stands to reason I couldn't figure out what the cargo is. IF the train is really the interest of the photo, then I'd like to be able to pick out details of it's cargo. There are plenty of non-railfans that visit this website.

If you try to put yourself in the screener's shoes, you would see 2 photos of the same train taken in the same spot, and one with somewhat better image quality.
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Old 03-21-2006, 01:00 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoydie17
If you try to put yourself in the screener's shoes, you would see 2 photos of the same train taken in the same spot, and one with somewhat better image quality.
That is exactly the reasoning, Sean. Thanks for pointing that out.
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Old 03-21-2006, 01:09 PM   #8
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One of my first rejections was for heat distortion. It was more prominent than either of the photos offered in this thread.

Ironically my photo was in -17 degree Minnesota Jan. I think you nailed with the distance problem.
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Old 03-21-2006, 07:04 PM   #9
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I prefer the rejected version myself because it appears to be better exposed. The accepted version just looks too dark for me. The cropping is better on the rejected version too in my opinion. The accepted version has the train too close to the center of the picture which leaves too much dead space on the right side of the frame and, again, I just can't get past the underexposure.


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Old 03-21-2006, 07:18 PM   #10
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I'm siding with you here William. Yea its the same spot but its two completely different shots. There are plenty of shots of the same train at the same location and they are just regular 3/4 shots. These two are doing different things. One is a backdrop and one is a background. There is no way around the heat distortion unless like was stated the train is stopped but that is not the case so it shouldn't be an issue. Heat distortion is natural in the "train world" just like steam engines produce smoke and steam diesels also have exhaust. And if its nature heat distortion like a telephoto desert shot in the summer that is also no reason for rejection because its part of that current scene, not made or added by the photographer. If it was rejected for being similar to previous it should have gotten that rejection reason not heat distortion which tells a story not takes away from the photo in ANY way. Your thread title is correct on this one.
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Old 03-21-2006, 07:33 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoydie17
If you try to put yourself in the screener's shoes, you would see 2 photos of the same train taken in the same spot, and one with somewhat better image quality.
The screeners have accepted photos of the same train and photo location from different photographers before, I've seen it more than once. I don't want to dig through the database though, maybe they'll turn up sooner or later.
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Old 03-21-2006, 08:14 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BNSF_SD40-2B
I don't want to dig through the database though, maybe they'll turn up sooner or later.
From memory I could pull up a few doubles and even one train that has three photos from not only the same location at almost the same angle. I won't post them here because its disrespectful and distasteful but it happens for shots less "similar" than these.
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Old 03-22-2006, 02:23 AM   #13
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No offense to the second photographer, but it seems that yours is a little underexposed compared to the first photographer.

William- as far as the heatwaves go, I dunno what to tell you. But maybe a little enhancing would make it a lil better.

Save this for your personal collection......

Rich

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Old 03-22-2006, 03:51 AM   #14
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I've had heat distortion rejections when it's been about 30 degrees below zero, I thought that was bogus and absurd, but after taking a few pictures and having this problem, I realized what was causing it. When you exhale, your breath will cause heat distortion (when it's that damn cold), in addition, car exhaust will also cause this.

Since most of us are giving our opinions... both have noticable heat distortion. If I were to upload either of these, I would anticpate rejections on both. I had a shot that had even less heat distortion than both of these that was rejected for that reason, it was 110degrees heat index up here (which is about as hot as it ever gets). Nothing you can do, just remember the more distance (zoom) there is, the more noticable distortion will be.
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Old 03-22-2006, 04:59 AM   #15
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I'm a newbie, but I like your composistion a lot more.
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Old 03-22-2006, 01:55 PM   #16
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I gotta agree with Joe... the first thing that jumped out at me was that the accepted pic seems underexposed. The heat ripples seem inconsequential to me (in both pix).

But this does bring up the issue of two photogs submitting similar views of similar equipment from the same location. The eternal struggle seems to be to find those interesting angles and odd equipment that make a photo unique.

It's a tough game to figure.
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Old 03-22-2006, 02:01 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crusader
two photogs submitting similar views of similar equipment from the same location.
As far as I can tell those 2 photogs might have been shoulder to shoulder taking these two pics. Although the dates on the photos are 1 day off (somethings wrong there), they are in the same location, same time, same train.
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Old 03-22-2006, 03:35 PM   #18
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I'm sure another problem screeners have is this: A good looking picture is uploaded into the queue, and is approved, but later that day an even better picture from from someone else of the same train/same place etc... is uploaded. I don't think you can take a photo out that has already been accepted, even though the second shot is of better quality than the first one accepted. I guess it is first come, first serve in a situation like that.
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Old 03-22-2006, 04:13 PM   #19
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If you're ever shooting with a fellow RP photog, here's a piece of advice. Upload first!!!




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Old 03-22-2006, 06:15 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe the Photog
If you're ever shooting with a fellow RP photog, here's a piece of advice. Upload first!!!
I hear that!!!
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Old 03-23-2006, 02:20 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe the Photog
If you're ever shooting with a fellow RP photog, here's a piece of advice. Upload first!!!




Joe
I got skunked by a fellow artist here with wireless broadband in his vehicle! We had the same shot of the CP Christmas Train.

But at any rate, William, this is an awesome shot.
Image © William Diehl
PhotoID: 137929
Photograph © William Diehl
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Old 03-23-2006, 02:28 AM   #22
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That is a very common problem and is likely the case in this situation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by willie6622
I'm sure another problem screeners have is this: A good looking picture is uploaded into the queue, and is approved, but later that day an even better picture from from someone else of the same train/same place etc... is uploaded. I don't think you can take a photo out that has already been accepted, even though the second shot is of better quality than the first one accepted. I guess it is first come, first serve in a situation like that.
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Old 03-23-2006, 03:53 AM   #23
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While we're on the subject, was just surfing the latest accepted pix from my area (PA) and noticed two nearly identical pix of CSX train Q301 at Langhorne PA, taken by two photographers (apparently standing 50 feet apart) on the same day. So...the plot thickens.
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Old 03-23-2006, 04:13 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by busyEMT
I got skunked by a fellow artist here with wireless broadband in his vehicle! We had the same shot of the CP Christmas Train.

But at any rate, William, this is an awesome shot.
Image © William Diehl
PhotoID: 137929
Photograph © William Diehl
yeah, that also got a heat distorion rejection...with another run though RAW essenscals and a slight crop it passed...I guess it depends on the screener, most of mine are uploaded late at night due to the nature of my life (school and I'm a pizza delivery guy), but day time uploads seem to fly better.
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Old 03-23-2006, 12:20 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe the Photog
If you're ever shooting with a fellow RP photog, here's a piece of advice. Upload first!!!




Joe
Or....instead of 'screwing' your buddy, work it out which of you will upload which shot when (if that makes sense). If you have virtually the same shots, stagger when you upload them.

Or, you could just be a schlong and try and beat that person to the punch...
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