Old 11-08-2007, 04:58 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ottergoose
So... are you saying the other comments are overly negative? Jim's may have been a little strange, but everything else looks like honest constructive criticism to me...
I thought you may have been referring to this post being strange:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Thais

Three reasons I see right away:

-high sun
-overexposed
-over saturated
For a new person, that isn't much help. One can get that much from just reading the rejection, and though I understand newer folks may not read the rejections or may miss them, it doesn't say how to improve his images in the least. It comes across as pompous.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:05 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by ccaranna
For a new person, that isn't much help. One can get that much from just reading the rejection, and though I understand newer folks may not read the rejections or may miss them, it doesn't say how to improve his images in the least. It comes across as pompous.
No one on the forum knew what the reasons were for rejection as the link to the rejection was never provided.

And how is it pompous to give a simple list of issues?
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:05 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
I want you all to know, each and every one of you have answered my questions and doubts about RailPictures.Net.
I don't understand what you mean.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:08 PM   #29
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I DO believe the O.P. asked "Any comments on this one?" regarding the picture he posted. "Any" can be construed in many ways, and my reply was simply one of the ways. My reply wasn't out of the ordinary, nor was it pompous. Often times people simply list the things a photo should/will be rejected for.

Do you not know what "high sun," "over exposed" and "over saturated" means? If not, I'll gladly explain.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:09 PM   #30
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Yes, you misunderstood me, but I appologize if I caused any confusion.
You are ALL GREAT, and responses are welcome.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:14 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
Yes, you misunderstood me, but I appologize if I caused any confusion.
You are ALL GREAT, and responses are welcome.
It's the nature of electronic/written communication... can't hear the inflection, so it's easy to misunderstand.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:21 PM   #32
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Ok, Ok, don't everyone jump down my throat...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC
And how is it pompous to give a simple list of issues?
Show me somewhere else on the internet where your photos are going to be rejected for "High Sun". While often it can be a valid rejection, a new person may not know what it means, or even looks like. I know there's about a hundred threads here about High Sun, but not everyone is going to use the search function to find an explanation, and since the rejection links expire, those threads don't do much good. If you guys are sick of explaning yourselves to new people, then don't hang around here so much. That simple list I quoted looks like you're sick of explaining things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Thais
Do you not know what "high sun," "over exposed" and "over saturated" means? If not, I'll gladly explain.
Sure, go for it. Let's hear the official explanation.

Last edited by ccaranna; 11-08-2007 at 05:51 PM. Reason: Toned it down a little
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:30 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccaranna
Show me somewhere else on the internet where your photos are going to be rejected for "High Sun". While often it can be a valid rejection, a new person may not know what it means, or even looks like. I know there's about a hundred threads here about High Sun, but not everyone is going to use the search function to find an explanation, and since the rejection links expire, those threads don't do much good. If you guys are sick of explaning yourselves to new people, then don't hang around here so much. That simple list I quoted looks like you're sick of explaining things.
First of all, http://m-w.com/dictionary/pompous
I see no pompousness in the list.

As far as explaining, the OP can certainly ask for more detail on anything not understood. Why does the answer need to fit your level of desired detail? It doesn't. I find that people here enjoy helping out. They do it all the time.

I guess I find it odd that you are having such a strong reaction to a simple list.
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:15 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
And now retired, it is restored and back at work pulling passenger trains, which is a positive thing, and great for railfans.
Instead of a shot that shows nothing but the locomotive - why don't you submit a shot that shows it in action pulling a passenger train ? I've seen the line where this unit operates. Park the car, climb up on one of the hills and try a panoramic view of the 844 with it's train in the valley ?
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:26 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
I guess the one thing I feel was missed is that this engine, #844 was the engine responsible for keeping UP 8444 from becoming its original number 844, until the GP30 was retired.
Back in the early 80's I took a slide of the 8444 passing the 844 in Denver. I'll have to scan it sometime...
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Old 11-08-2007, 09:15 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rpalmer
Instead of a shot that shows nothing but the locomotive - why don't you submit a shot that shows it in action pulling a passenger train ? I've seen the line where this unit operates. Park the car, climb up on one of the hills and try a panoramic view of the 844 with it's train in the valley ?
I agree. That's an interesting looking engine, and I'd love to see a picture of it in action.
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Old 11-09-2007, 02:51 AM   #37
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I'm guessing none of the UP GP30 b-units survived, did they? Now that would be cooler than cool. The UP GP30s are among my favorite locos that I've never seen in person.


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Old 11-09-2007, 12:39 PM   #38
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I find the FORUM and replies much more rewarding than the submittal process.
The responses sure seem to COVER THE GAMBIT! And that in itself makes it very interesting. I didn't mean to push so many "buttons"! But it is quite the experience, and summarizes my questions and feelings as to this site. I am thankful for the rejection(s) as I have learned so much. And for the record, I DO understand all the details - for me, it was a SIMPLE question, but I definately received more than a simple answer in many cases. I thank ALL for your honesty, and reinforcement.
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:59 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
I find the FORUM and replies much more rewarding than the submittal process.
The responses sure seem to COVER THE GAMBIT! And that in itself makes it very interesting. I didn't mean to push so many "buttons"! But it is quite the experience, and summarizes my questions and feelings as to this site. I am thankful for the rejection(s) as I have learned so much. And for the record, I DO understand all the details - for me, it was a SIMPLE question, but I definately received more than a simple answer in many cases. I thank ALL for your honesty, and reinforcement.
Wohoo! I'm glad you found us (them) helpful.
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Old 11-10-2007, 12:37 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccaranna
For a new person, that isn't much help. One can get that much from just reading the rejection, and though I understand newer folks may not read the rejections or may miss them, it doesn't say how to improve his images in the least. It comes across as pompous.
So, helping newbies and just giving them your opinions on why photos were rejected is pompous?

I probably could have written something similar to his post, but it was already covered. Then, there was a comment about the fence, which wasn't actually a problem. Not quite sure I understand the response(s) to my post, however...

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Old 11-10-2007, 12:44 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias
Do you not know what "high sun," "over exposed" and "over saturated" means? If not, I'll gladly explain.
Since we're talking about a person who obviously is wanting us to be "specific"...

From http://space.about.com/od/glossaries/g/highsun.htm

High sun: The condition of the sun being directly overhead (analogous to noon) which eliminates shadows on the surface.

From http://www.photographytips.com/page.cfm/273

Overexposure: Too much light for proper exposure.

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturation

Saturation: the intensity of a specific hue.

Clear enough?
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Old 11-10-2007, 12:48 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by sopacific
Now that is a really appreciated reply. It was POSITIVE and welcome. I know it is all to easy to get into criticism and negativity, but without criticism I guess one wouldn't improve. It is just nice to have it in a positive form.
Thanks. sopacifc John
Well, I guess I'm glad you liked my reply, but don't take constructive criticism like many of the other posts the way you seem to be taking it. If my post is the only post that you like here, then you should rethink your reason for posting here.

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Old 11-12-2007, 02:47 PM   #43
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Summary - at least 33.3% of photos on RP.net, if submitted by me, would have been rejected. Too many to reference, but congrats to those more fortunate, if that is the proper terminology. Reinforces my feelings. Enjoy your little clique. Hasta la vista.
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Old 11-12-2007, 03:07 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
Summary - at least 33.3% of photos on RP.net, if submitted by me, would have been rejected. Too many to reference, but congrats to those more fortunate, if that is the proper terminology. Reinforces my feelings. Enjoy your little clique. Hasta la vista.
Suonds like someone has been playing us and that he had his obvious "feelings" before he posted here as "sopacific."


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Old 11-12-2007, 03:43 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe the Photog
Suonds like someone has been playing us and that he had his obvious "feelings" before he posted here as "sopacific."


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If sopacific is who I think it is, then I would have to say no. I believe he may be someone who emailed me a few days back about one of my shots and wondered if I had any advice on how to get shots on here. Naturally, I recommended these forums, but I did it with a little misgiving due to some subtle changes I've been noticing amongst posters on these forums. I gave them the warning that it could be slow going getting up to RP level because many of the posters miss the forest for the trees. Unless he'd posted here before, that was the only preconceived notion they had.

Sadly, sopacific's introduction to these forums ended up following the worst scenario I could come up with, ending with confusion, frustration and flared tempers amongst those involved. While their opening post wasn't ideal, it looked like things might go along fine will some of the posters I'm starting to have issues with chimed in and essentially made a mess of things, as I feared they would. At least Mr. Palmer had some good general advice for him.

I enjoy these forums as much as the next person, and there are posters here who clearly enjoy helping others. But I'm wondering if it isn't going to some people's heads, as these forums are starting to take a slightly arrogant tone as I see it, and posters who previously gave great advice are now being vague in their responses, almost as if they are tired of helping yet another new person. Quite frankly, it's a little embarrassing for me since I recommended these forums in the first place. So hopefully we can all make a concerted effort to be more patient with those who post here. Yes, we're going to be answering the same questions over and over, but we can maintain the reputation as being a great place for photo advice, no matter who is doing the asking or how they ask.
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Old 11-12-2007, 03:55 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
I want you all to know, each and every one of you have answered my questions and doubts about RailPictures.Net.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
But it is quite the experience, and summarizes my questions and feelings as to this site.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sopacific
Summary - at least 33.3% of photos on RP.net, if submitted by me, would have been rejected. Too many to reference, but congrats to those more fortunate, if that is the proper terminology. Reinforces my feelings. Enjoy your little clique. Hasta la vista.

Ok, it's open season now. Looks like someone is a whiny little baby who hasn't quite got the grasp for quality railroad photography, so he directs his anguish toward this site.

"Questions and doubts about Railpictures.net?"

"Questions and feelings as to this site?"

Oh, DO TELL. We're all waiting with baited breath to hear your feelings about railpics.

Instead of running off like a spoiled little brat, why don't you post some examples of that "33%" that you feel would be rejected if YOU submitted them? And when you do that, post YOUR comparitive pictures so we can be the jury. If you're SO sure railpics would reject your photos of similar quality to those already in the database, I'm sure most of us here would be willing to convince the screeners of your worthiness.

For future reference, if you're going cop an attitude like that, don't EVER expect anyone to be willing to help.
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Old 11-12-2007, 04:03 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias

Ok, it's open season now. Looks like someone is a whiny little baby who hasn't quite got the grasp for quality railroad photography, so he directs his anguish toward this site.

"Questions and doubts about Railpictures.net?"

"Questions and feelings as to this site?"

Oh, DO TELL. We're all waiting with baited breath to hear your feelings about railpics.

Instead of running off like a spoiled little brat, why don't you post some examples of that "33%" that you feel would be rejected if YOU submitted them? And when you do that, post YOUR comparitive pictures so we can be the jury. If you're SO sure railpics would reject your photos of similar quality to those already in the database, I'm sure most of us here would be willing to convince the screeners of your worthiness.

For future reference, if you're going cop an attitude like that, don't EVER expect anyone to be willing to help.
Chill out, Jim and read my previous post (editted version). Since when were these forums a place where it was "open season" on posters who didn't agree with us or didn't have an ideal attitude?
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Old 11-12-2007, 04:10 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ken45
Chill out, Jim and read my previous post (editted version). Since when were these forums a place where it was "open season" on posters who didn't agree with us or didn't have an ideal attitude?
Don't worry, ken, I enjoyed typing that post.

For the record, I posted before your edited post appeared. And after reading your update, I must say, you're taking these forums WAY too personally. There are a gazillion forums on the web. EVERY ONE of them is like this from time to time (well, I'd guess at least a majority. haha). Things get heated, people say stuff they shouldn't, stuff gets smoothed out, everyone gets over it. Wash, rinse, repeat. Furthermore, there is NO reason you should feel embarrassed over something you have ZERO control over.

Last edited by JimThias; 11-12-2007 at 04:16 PM.
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Old 11-12-2007, 05:59 PM   #49
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OK, I reread this post in it's entirety from beginning to end again.

When I was questioned as to why I thought some of the posts were pompous (or more correctly arrogant), the following is the one that came to mind. At the risk of getting a defensive response, here it is:

Quote:
It's very hard to get photos in here period.
Followed up by:

Quote:
How do you figure? I find it quite easy, actually.
Whether or not the intent was to be arrogant, please try to think how that looks to someone (sopacific in this case) that is frustrated and really wants to get a photo accepted here. What may be *easy* for some can be quite difficult for others.

What ever happened to Michael F. Allen? His replies were always helpful, same with John West, Mitch Goldman, Christine, and WembYard (Janet) and a few other accomplished photographers that made brief appearances occasionally. No offense to anyone else who also means well, but the folks I mentioned often replied with patience and wouldn't give quick one-liner responses 5 minutes after the poster shared their rejects. They gave me the impression that they were actually taking the time to study the photo and give it worthy critique.
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Old 11-12-2007, 06:25 PM   #50
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Truthfully, I find these forums to be some of the best on the web in helping rail photogs take better rail photography. Here are a few reasons --

1.) The shooters who try to help are by far some of the best photographers in comparision to other forums. If someone here tells me my shot needs to be in my personal collection, I will at least try to see that POV even if I have to be led there kicking and screaming.

2.) The forums are busy compared to the others I have gone to.

3.) The advice here is good, even if not always delivered in the best style. Yes, I know when we (I can be short with some posters, I realize) are gruff and rough around the edges, the person asking the question might be turned off from what we're trying to say. I see that. But they're also the ones that asked the questions. They have some responsibility to get past the crud.

As I was saying, the advice is usually dead on. Case in point is this thread --

http://forums.railpictures.net/showthread.php?t=6150

where almost everyone who replied told the poster that the screener was wrong adn he should try again. On some forums, this advice would be followed by a statement of, "That's why I don't post to the site." Or some such non sense. Coming from this forum, the advice held more water and he got his shot in.

Other rail photography forums tend to turn into ainti-RP forums in about two short days.

4.) Sometimes the admins and screeners poke their nose in and offer some advice too.

I don't know why some of the folks you mentioned don't post more. I know Mitch still comes around. Sometimes people fall out of a habbit or just decide it's not for them. Maybe it's true they don't like the way the board sometimes handles itself.

But with that said, for every post where someone calls CR out, there's another post from someone who is trying to help him out with his questions. And consider Carl Becker. I think we've all seen him come a long way from when he started posting. He's a fine photographer and at least a small part is because of these boards, I bet. (Not trying to put words into your mouth. You can tell me if I'm wrong.)

We all need to step back every now and then and think about what we might be about to post. I told CR last week he needed to start learning how to tell the truth. Was that harsh? Maybe. But I stand by that post. And I doubt it caused him serious harm. CR is actually a good shooter and might get better with more practice and some advice.


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