Old 02-23-2012, 11:31 PM   #1
Ron Flanary
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Default Too Grainy?

I'm not normally inclined to ask (out of a sense I should probably already know...), but is this too grainy to upload to RP.net? It was shot in 1983 on color neg film--but I kind of like the effect of the brake shoe smoke and the overall composition. It's not a "winner," but again--I kind of like it.

Rotten apples or unkind words would be appreciated. It's no big deal either way.

(By the way...the more I look at it on the screen...yep, it's too grainy. Can't shoot it today, though, for obvious reasons...)

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Old 02-23-2012, 11:50 PM   #2
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It is the mountain in the background that really shows the noise. You could try some Gaussian blur in the majority of the upper right hand corner to help smooth the grain out. Then take a brush to smooth around the objects.
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Old 02-23-2012, 11:54 PM   #3
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Did some noise removal in Paint.net. I don't think it looks too bad.
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Old 02-24-2012, 12:37 AM   #4
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Email me the full size photo Ron and I figure I can get rid of that pesky noise..

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:18 AM   #5
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To hard to tell but looks soft? Retry the scan.
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Old 02-24-2012, 12:05 PM   #6
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Really guys...I just threw this up for discussion grist. It's just an okay image that might not be "RP-Worthy," at least in today's technical/digital imaging terms. Back in the "old days" (my world), it would be fine for most uses, including print publication. There's only so much time I would be willing to mess around with this image, or anything else.

Thanks for the comments, though. One must consider the technical limitations of consumer-level imagery from 30, 40 or 50 years ago. You can't compare an image of this nature against a recent digital shot taken with a Canon N007LS with Powerglide and Heated Shutter Release. It's literally apples and oranges (or silver halide and pixels).
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Old 02-25-2012, 11:00 AM   #7
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Thanks for the comments, though. One must consider the technical limitations of consumer-level imagery from 30, 40 or 50 years ago.
I think there a shot you have something but hard to tell with out seeing the slide. Some just don't scan well.
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Old 02-25-2012, 11:31 AM   #8
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I think there a shot you have something but hard to tell with out seeing the slide. Some just don't scan well.
It's a color negative. I had just purchased a new Nikon, and I ran a roll of negative film through it one afternoon, including that particular shot early in the morning on the way to work. You're right, though, some negs/slides just don't scan all that well---and this one might be a good example.

Also, this is a good case study of the persnickety nature of digital imagery as viewed on a computer screen vs. print media. In simple terms, this shot would make a nice "accent" image in a double-page spread (not the main photo, however, as its softness betrays enlargement to that level).

I think this is my tendency to see images not so much as stand-alones, but more as building blocks for a larger graphic presentation. In music, it's called harmony. The ultimate performance is not the main melodic line, but the polyphonic blend of several complementary elements.

That's way off track from "it doesn't scan well," but there might actually be a point there, somewhere.
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Old 02-25-2012, 11:49 AM   #9
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Yea I have a bunch that doesn't fit what they need for shots but work well telling a story in a slide show and thats why I have them. No loss as they will make a show some time.
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Old 02-25-2012, 12:57 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Flanary View Post
Also, this is a good case study of the persnickety nature of digital imagery as viewed on a computer screen vs. print media. In simple terms, this shot would make a nice "accent" image in a double-page spread (not the main photo, however, as its softness betrays enlargement to that level).

I think this is my tendency to see images not so much as stand-alones, but more as building blocks for a larger graphic presentation. In music, it's called harmony. The ultimate performance is not the main melodic line, but the polyphonic blend of several complementary elements.

That's way off track from "it doesn't scan well," but there might actually be a point there, somewhere.
There is a point, but as a matter of logic and accuracy, I feel compelled to point out (aargh, that compulsion again!) that this has nothing to do with "digital". If anything, digital makes this, too, easier; if I took the time I think I could make a double page spread in 10 minutes.

That spread, if relying on my images, would have the same aesthetic problems that it would have had 40 years ago using technology of that era...

But back to the main point, One time George Hamlin recommended "Wheat Kings" by Greg McDonnel to me, and what I found is a book with lots of solid images but not necessarily that many or any awesome images. But the totality is such that overall the book is just fantastic, the overall work soars above its content (which is quite good, don't get me wrong, this isn't a putdown of the individual images). A blend, indeed.
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Old 02-25-2012, 08:54 PM   #11
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There is a point, but as a matter of logic and accuracy, I feel compelled to point out (aargh, that compulsion again!) that this has nothing to do with "digital". If anything, digital makes this, too, easier; if I took the time I think I could make a double page spread in 10 minutes....One time George Hamlin recommended "Wheat Kings" by Greg McDonnel to me, and what I found is a book with lots of solid images but not necessarily that many or any awesome images. But the totality is such that overall the book is just fantastic, the overall work soars above its content (which is quite good, don't get me wrong, this isn't a putdown of the individual images). A blend, indeed.
Well, yes, it does have something to do with "digital"---at least the one-at-a-time viewing process that's RP.net, or any other internet image viewing site. And, to say you could make a double page spread in ten minutes is like me saying I could compose a song in that amount of time. I could--but I'm certain I wouldn't win a Grammy.

"White Kings" is a splendid book. And, in citing that example, you did make my point. It's the totality of the images that's "fantastic." One-at-a-time, the images are less inspired.
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Old 02-25-2012, 09:19 PM   #12
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If anything, digital makes this, too, easier; if I took the time I think I could make a double page spread in 10 minutes.
Well...you're right: it does make it easier. In about ten minutes, I worked up this simple spread using that particular photo as an "accent" shot---plus two other shots of mine I downloaded from RP. Throw in an SR emblem, some fake verbiage, and presto!---you've got a spread.

But again--to my point--you see this is a spread first, and not just one-image-at-a-time. Your brain is wired to see the spread itself as a composition. It's only then that you zone in on the individual images.

In this sense, that grainy little shot at Tito, VA works just fine---digital or otherwise.

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Old 02-25-2012, 11:04 PM   #13
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Gosh, Ron, even when appearing in a spread, that shot on the left is obviously unlevel!
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Old 02-25-2012, 11:32 PM   #14
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Gosh, Ron, even when appearing in a spread, that shot on the left is obviously unlevel!
Hey....ask RP: they accepted it.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:13 AM   #15
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RP is soooo easy on ol' #6, it's pathetic!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:52 AM   #16
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RP is soooo easy on ol' #6, it's pathetic!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm not picking on RP--you are. I thought they made an appropriate decision to accept that shot. You were the one who suggested it was "unlevel."

Neither did I say anything critical of RP. I merely said you should "ask" RP, because they accepted it.
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:24 AM   #17
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I'm not picking on RP--you are. I thought they made an appropriate decision to accept that shot. You were the one who suggested it was "unlevel."

Neither did I say anything critical of RP. I merely said you should "ask" RP, because they accepted it.
Perhaps had I replaced the string of exclamation points with a sequence of smileys, my intended tone would have been clearer.
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Old 02-26-2012, 04:37 AM   #18
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Lightbulb Ai!

Perhaps RP should have a scanned film, or scanned slide section.

I like it, and I think you should leave it as it is.

Additionally, I think the rejection is unwarranted based on the fact that it is obviously a print or a slide.

I tend to look at the old images rather than the current 3/4 wedgies.

But, that is is what I like.
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Old 02-27-2012, 02:16 AM   #19
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But back to the main point, One time George Hamlin recommended "Wheat Kings" by Greg McDonnel to me, and what I found is a book with lots of solid images but not necessarily that many or any awesome images. But the totality is such that overall the book is just fantastic, the overall work soars above its content (which is quite good, don't get me wrong, this isn't a putdown of the individual images). A blend, indeed.
Occasionally I can give good advice...glad that you enjoyed!

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