Need some Pointers on Back lighting...

=SPETER= · 07-08-2010, 07:20 AM

Went shooting today and uploaded what I thought was the best shot of the day. Came back rejection due to being back lit.

Can I get some pointers on either fixing it or setting up for a better photo? Or would an earlier shot like the second one be better?

Thanks for your help again.

N. Herring · 07-08-2010, 07:26 AM

Simply put there is not enough light on the nose to make this a RP shot, is there a way you can reshoot it at the time of day best for the direction? It is a very nice location that would make a great shot for RP, just need the sun to help you out. (also looks cloudy to me as the light is really flat.)

=SPETER= · 07-08-2010, 07:58 AM

The other direction is great during the after noon/evening because there is an S-Curve. Catching trains from the south like the one shown is tough for lighting.... I'm wondering if cloudy is really a negative feature of a photo or if it really just depends?

Joe the Photog · 07-08-2010, 08:15 AM

I like the framing and composition much better in the shot where the train is closer to you. The other one doesn't grab me as much. Don't confuse a shot that gets rejected from RP as being one that isn't good. In this case, your shot is average now, but with a little processing could be much better. It needs a little pop. I would add a touch more saturation, play around with shadows and highlights and sharpen it just a hair. I don't know if it makes RP then, but IMHO you'd have a much better photograph.

=SPETER= · 07-08-2010, 08:30 AM

Ok... those are good suggestions. Giving it a shot... Hope I didn't tweak it too much.

nikos1 · 07-08-2010, 01:56 PM

Its a nice location, but the light is pretty poor. No noselight and looks like your shooting through a pretty small gap in the clouds.

EMTRailfan · 07-08-2010, 03:17 PM

I hope you don't mind me jumping on your thread, but I saw no point to start another for the same rejection:
http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...d=832820&key=0
My intention was obviously to go back lit. Whether for RP or not, was it a successful attempt? I didn't particularly care for the color, but my intentions were to go B/W from the get-go anyway when I fired for the contrast in the backlighting like in the attached thumb. Not really looking for whether to reprocess, appeal, etc. Just if it is a decent photo, just not a good RP photo or not.

PhotoID: 284097
Photograph © Kevin Ashbaugh

JRMDC · 07-08-2010, 03:26 PM

Not a fan, Kevin. Much of the structure of the bridge shows as one big black blob (so the backlight really hurts), whereas the accepted shot has more intricate detail and much less solid black. The engines are not readily visible, they don't stand out as engines in terms of silhouettes (again, the backlight doesn't help) and the nearest one is obstructed. The background is dull. Sorry, not a fan.

EMTRailfan · 07-08-2010, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRMDC

Not a fan, Kevin. Much of the structure of the bridge shows as one big black blob (so the backlight really hurts), whereas the accepted shot has more intricate detail and much less solid black. The engines are not readily visible, they don't stand out as engines in terms of silhouettes (again, the backlight doesn't help) and the nearest one is obstructed. The background is dull. Sorry, not a fan.

True, I see your reasoning now. I'll toss this one into the "A for effort" folder. Do you think having a lower sun and backing out the distance/getting some elevation to show light between the rails and train would be worth a future attempt for a silhouette?

=SPETER= · 07-08-2010, 05:04 PM

I don't like the angle of the bridge. Get a side shot or stand by the end for more of a direct on at a higher elevation. I can't make out what the train really is, I see too much of the bridge with either rust or graininess.

Now the photos that I did, was the processing too much or should I just scrap it and go take another because of a cloudy day? Its hit or miss at this location... another issue is getting a good set of power like shown in the shot.

I did get another photo farther down line...

Do I just have a back lit disease?

troy12n · 07-08-2010, 05:04 PM

Nose light is one of those things they are pretty inconsistent on. But more often than not they will reject based on not having full nose light.

JRMDC · 07-08-2010, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EMTRailfan

True, I see your reasoning now. I'll toss this one into the "A for effort" folder. Do you think having a lower sun and backing out the distance/getting some elevation to show light between the rails and train would be worth a future attempt for a silhouette?

In my view the key to a good silhouette is to have an interesting shape being silhouetted. It seems plausible that backing out would help. Lower sun is always good, so the background is not harsh. Personally, I like a color silhouette with an interesting sky color.

Joe the Photog · 07-08-2010, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troy12n

Nose light is one of those things they are pretty inconsistent on. But more often than not they will reject based on not having full nose light.

In some ways, it almost seems like a little nose light will mean a rejection before no nose light will. It all depends on the individual shot. As far as the OP, I still like the original shot in the thread better. The second processing leaves some too be desired in my opinion. he oranges and greens don't look right.

As far as Kevin's shot, the angle was the first thing that struck me. You're too far under the bridge. Could you have scooted back like one of my favorite RP photogs did in tis shot?

PhotoID:
Photograph ©

EMTRailfan · 07-08-2010, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by =SPETER=

Do I just have a back lit disease?

In all of your photos, it appears that you have direct side lighting. For these wedge angle photos, RP likes the nose and the facing side of the train lit. Rule of thumb is to have the sun over your shoulder with your shadow pointing at your subject.

With that said, it also appears like there is also not enough sunlight shining on the subjects, in your case, AKA "Cloud F...ed". This will also get you the cloudy/common power rejection as usually given in an overcast photo.

EMTRailfan · 07-08-2010, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe the Photog

As far as Kevin's shot, the angle was the first thing that struck me. You're too far under the bridge. Could you have scooted back like one of my favorite RP photogs did in tis shot?

PhotoID:
Photograph ©

On this day-no. The train was hot on our heals, as contributor Jon Clark and I pretty much sprinted from my car to get this far. The others chasing with us opted to not even attempt as you will note if you look closely under the bridge.

On a future attempt-yes, but the sun will still have to be lower so it is behind the bridge and not a plasmic blob in the photo. There is no real elevation to be had here unless you park on the side of I-79 which is a no-no, but maybe I'll just cross THAT bridge when I get to it.

=SPETER= · 07-08-2010, 05:49 PM

Hiking boots to the rightaway?

Thanks for the help on mine... I'll archive them and call them practice shots.

Greg P · 07-08-2010, 06:06 PM

I had a big problem with back lighting when I was starting out. A forum member here told me to look at my shadow. If my shadow isn't pointing at the train, then the shot will most likely be backlit.

Now every time I arrive to take photos, I check my shadow before doing anything.

But now I'm having problems that my shadow points directly at the rails so both directions are backlit

Joe the Photog · 07-08-2010, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EMTRailfan

On this day-no. The train was hot on our heals, as contributor Jon Clark and I pretty much sprinted from my car to get this far.

Been there, done that too. Understandable. I'm sure I made a few crew shake their heads in disblief running to a spot and every once in a while, not getting there and like a moron throwing my arms up in the air in disgust.

EMTRailfan · 07-08-2010, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg P

I had a big problem with back lighting when I was starting out. A forum member here told me to look at my shadow. If my shadow isn't pointing at the train, then the shot will most likely be backlit.

Now every time I arrive to take photos, I check my shadow before doing anything.

But now I'm having problems that my shadow points directly at the rails so both directions are backlit

Find a curve

jnohallman · 07-08-2010, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe the Photog

Could you have scooted back like one of my favorite RP photogs did in tis shot?

He says completely deadpan . . .

Jon