A Better "Cook" than Ben

[Holloran Grade]

Someone is a better cook than Ben.

PhotoID: 453081 Photograph © Vadim Anokhin

BTW - I like it.

[JRMDC]

I like it too, but wow! New territory for RP screening. Cool. We'll see if this is a one-off or a pattern.

[Holloran Grade]

I have been cooking some of my images for a while, especially the night shots, but in this one the affect is rather pronounced.

[troy12n]

Best "cook" ever:

[PLEzero]

Originally Posted by troy12n

Best "cook" ever:

Bazinga!

[JMC]

Interesting

[JMC]

This actually reminds me of the paintings from the old Department of Defense books from the 80s about the Soviet Military.

[Mgoldman]

Speaking of cooks -

PhotoID: 453514 Photograph © Thomas J. Nanos - www.nanosphoto.com

Who ever screened this probably likes his burgers charred crispy, if not crunchy!

My compliments to the chef!



/Mitch

(No disrespect to Tom - a great photographer, though this one is definitely a bit over cooked!)

[Holloran Grade]

PhotoID: 444837 Photograph © EL ROCO Photography

PhotoID: 435959 Photograph © EL ROCO Photography

PhotoID: 435152 Photograph © EL ROCO Photography

PhotoID: 434856 Photograph © EL ROCO Photography

PhotoID: 433549 Photograph © EL ROCO Photography

PhotoID: 431923 Photograph © EL ROCO Photography

[JRMDC]

Re the first shot and Nanos', the floodgates are hereby proclaimed to be open!!!

So has RP opened up a new dimension in acceptable photos? Regrettably, I have no suitable shots with which to conduct my own test. Or I'll have to dig a bit, as frankly while I love color and color effects and would like to see more RP acceptance of them (admittedly, the subjectivity factor goes through the roof!), I've not dabbled in them myself.

[Mgoldman]

The flood gates may be open, but there's always been a steady trickle....

Recall this one from Travis in 2009:

PhotoID: 271011 Photograph © Travis Dewitz

... I could go on and on.

Some are done quite well, almost real or real enough - some crazy but appealing while others should have their HDR privileges revoked!

Holloran - if you're going to prove a point, go only with the truly exaggerated examples. Most of those are quite tasteful.

/Mitch

[JRMDC]

Mitch, you and I are not seeing the same things. I view the original posted shot and the Nanos shots as, well, I need a term, let's call them enhanced color shots. Travis' shot, and Ben's recent Sand Patch shot, aren't doing that, they are what I will call enhanced tone mapping shots. The latter have been around; the former, not just candyland, not just high-saturation, but really strong color effects, not so much.

[Mgoldman]

Originally Posted by JRMDC

Mitch, you and I are not seeing the same things. I view the original posted shot and the Nanos shots as, well, I need a term, let's call them enhanced color shots. Travis' shot, and Ben's recent Sand Patch shot, aren't doing that, they are what I will call enhanced tone mapping shots. The latter have been around; the former, not just candyland, not just high-saturation, but really strong color effects, not so much.

Advanced color / advanced tone mapping - you say tomato, I say tomato.

All the same in varying degrees...

/Mitch

[Holloran Grade]

Originally Posted by Mgoldman

.....Holloran - if you're going to prove a point, go only with the truly exaggerated examples. Most of those are quite tasteful.

"Most......."

I look at tone mapping (aka HDR) as a tool to enhance an image, rather than a crutch to create an image.

Further, I am not really into acid trip HDR's, although some are quite interesting.

Like everything else, "quite tasteful" is what I am after.

[Mgoldman]

Originally Posted by Holloran Grade

"Most......."

I look at tone mapping (aka HDR) as a tool to enhance an image, rather than a crutch to create an image.

Further, I am not really into acid trip HDR's, although some are quite interesting.

Like everything else, "quite tasteful" is what I am after.

Some more successful then others, though on closer inspection, none are overcooked and all were tastefully done. My earlier observation was based on loose recall and the fact that you yourself added the images within the thread sharing "cooked" images.

/Mitch

[CSX1702]

Originally Posted by Holloran Grade

There it is. Admit it, you made this thread with the intent of posting your own pics on here.

[JRMDC]

Originally Posted by Mgoldman

Advanced color / advanced tone mapping - you say tomato, I say tomato.

All the same in varying degrees...

/Mitch

Well, not for me, in that I separate tonality remapping - brighter/darker - from color changes, whether remapped or funky saturation, etc. Tomato/orange, still fruit, but different.

[Holloran Grade]

Originally Posted by Mgoldman

Advanced color / advanced tone mapping - you say tomato, I say tomato.

All the same in varying degrees...

Actually no, they are quite different in what the computer is doing to the image.

Enhancing the color usually involves changing the sliders for the color channels and perhaps some contrast and/or saturation manipulation.

Example:

PhotoID: 292998 Photograph © EL ROCO Photography

or


Hot Rail by El Roco Photography, on Flickr


Whereas, tone mapping changes the dynamics of the high channel (light) and the low channel (dark) throughout the image, in addition to the color and contrast that are manipulated in the same image as before.

Example:

PhotoID: 430240 Photograph © EL ROCO Photography

With tone mapping I can tone down the highlights and bring out definition in the shadows to even out the image as a whole.

I can further emphasize the orange color in the sky with the color sliders as usual.


All of this is contrasted against a true HDR image such as this one.


Desert Twilight by El Roco Photography, on Flickr

This is a three frame composite of the same image shot at differing exposures to emphasize different parts of the image; highs, lows and mid-points in the light.

[Mgoldman]

Holloren - I wish you did not jump in as I was really looking forward to attaching a photo of Jane Curtin with J's face and Dan Aykroyd followed by the statement "J, you ignorant slut", lol.

Alas...

Based on J's statement and examples... he seemed to be implying that HDR and Tone Mapping were different in that one boosted color where as the other boosted detail.

Obviously "advanced color" - a term that I believe was just invented, obviously is different then HDR /Tone Mapping.

Theoretically, however, an HDR IS a tone mapped image.

An HDR takes the best parts of multiple exposures and combines them into one scene yielding the best detail throughout the tonal range.

A tone mapped image is similar in that it lightens the dark areas and darkens the bright areas (back to the levels which a sensor or film could not capture).

Both often have slider controls for color boost and both often have sliders for "detail" though I'm not quite sure what that is actually doing - as it seems to be adding detail not really there, or at least enhancing to extreme degrees the amount of depth, contrast and sharpening. The resulting images, consequently, appear TACK sharp as an added bonus.

/Mitch

[Holloran Grade]

Originally Posted by Mgoldman

Holloren - I wish you did not jump in as I was really looking forward to attaching a photo of Jane Curtin with J's face and Dan Aykroyd followed by the statement "J, you ignorant slut", lol.

Actually, I am anticipating Thias is going to jump in at some point and want to litigate the definition of what an HDR is.

Originally Posted by Mgoldman

........ The resulting images, consequently, appear TACK sharp as an added bonus.

It does, unless you tell the program to "smooth" the effect out.

Also, your image gets grainier as the effect is enhanced.

The more digital information you start with (the bigger the RAW file) the better things work.

This one was heavily cropped since I was far away.


Musicians [2013 Los Angeles Chinatown Harvest Festival Series] by El Roco Photography, on Flickr


Ergo, this is what I could use that $1700.00 70-200mm 2.8 L for.

[JRMDC]

Originally Posted by Mgoldman

Based on J's statement and examples... he seemed to be implying that HDR and Tone Mapping were different in that one boosted color where as the other boosted detail.

Nope, you misread me.

[Mgoldman]

Originally Posted by JRMDC

Nope, you misread me.

I believe both are HDR's.

Toms, overcooked.

Vadim Anokhin - near perfection.
What is going on there? Seems noise free - is it not an HDR?
It is a bit "warm", needs a bit less yellow as the green tint is a bit strong.

But J, you suggested both Vadim Anokhin's and Tom's shot as one side of the coin.

/Mitch

[JRMDC]

My issue with Tom's shot is the color, not the tonality mapping. I've come to allow for and even enjoy some or considerable adjustments to tonality, such as Ben's Sand Patch shot. And Travis'. I don't view Ben's shot as being "off" in color in any way, other than of course a bit more vivid. It's really nice.

In Tom's, he's got some funky saturation in the green/yellow range. Look at the grasses on the left, especially further back. Look at the trees on the left. Look at the side of the building. Yes, he has also done tone mapping, but I am fine with his efforts in that dimension. The color, however, seems whack.

In the Russia image which started off this thread, look at the platform pavement. Funky green! The concrete ties also. Overall it has an interesting color mix, heavy on pastels. Yes, night shots are tricky, but this one seems to have cooked things in a particular way. (Are there green sodium lights?) I happen to like it, but it is outside of the RP norm. So is Tom's, for the color, not the tone mapping (well done in that regard!).

I"m not seeing a large amount of tone mapping in the Russia shot, could be wrong. Or maybe the overwhelming first impression is that of color, tone comes second.

One can certainly say that color mapping and tone (B/W) mapping are flip sides of the same greater coin, in that they are what one might call shifts of the original information for the pixel. And maybe I am wrong in how I am using the word tonality (although I am using it in the same way Hol is using the term tone mapping, distinct from color mapping). I find it a useful distinction, and in this context it is particularly useful in that RP has been tolerant of tone mapping for some time but, until this thread showed otherwise, not so tolerant of color mapping.

[Hatchetman]

Thomas Kinkade is the best at this hokum.

[JimThias]

Originally Posted by Holloran Grade

Actually, I am anticipating Thias is going to jump in at some point and want to litigate the definition of what an HDR is.

Damn you. I've been enjoying the debate between J and Mitch and now you have to call me out.

I'm going to keep my opinions to myself on this matter. Just give me the shadow/highlights and vibrance tools in CS5 and I'm happy.