Old 01-04-2008, 05:39 PM   #1
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,838
Default Bad contrast

So which is it...too much or too little?

The switchstand looks dark, but the four figures look spot on to me as far as contrast goes. Any suggestions?

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...&key=401509251
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 05:48 PM   #2
JRMDC
Senior Member
 
JRMDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,202
Default

WHERE'S THE TRAIN????????????



Great series, Jim, several already accepted. On this one, I have no idea either, the switchstand looks dark so I think too much contrast. Drop the contrast a bit and raise the brightness (workrers should be relatively unaffected overall, maybe) and see what it looks like.
__________________
My RP pix are here.
My Flickr pix are here.

My commentaries on rail pictures are in my blog.

RP Photo Albums:
Cabooses
Engine Details
Farm and Train
Plumes!
Railroad Details
Signal Details
Switchstand Shots
JRMDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 06:24 PM   #3
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,838
Default

Ok, redo:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...d=465373&key=0

Paging screener...Paging screener...

JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 06:47 PM   #4
trainboysd40
Senior Member
 
trainboysd40's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Calgary, Alberta on the CP Laggan Subdivision
Posts: 2,048
Send a message via MSN to trainboysd40
Default

I hate to say it, but there's something about this picture that I can't put my finger on.
Maybe it's that the switchstand is too high
Maybe it's that the switchstand is too prominent for being out of focus.
At least I know it's not that I don't like it because there's no train. Plus, that sentence has far too many negatives!
__________________
got a D5 IIi and now he doesnt afread fo 12800 iSO
Youtube (Model Railway, Vlogs, Tutorials, and prototype)
My Website
Obligatory link to shots on RP, HERE
trainboysd40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 06:48 PM   #5
Freericks
Met Fan
 
Freericks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 4,042
Default

That's a very cool shot... No idea how to help though. I'm stumped.
Freericks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 09:48 PM   #6
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,838
Default

Ok...here are two other shots from that same day. In terms of contrast and levels, I thought I processed them pretty much all the same.

Image © Jim Thias
PhotoID: 217778
Photograph © Jim Thias

Image © Jim Thias
PhotoID: 217781
Photograph © Jim Thias

Last edited by JimThias; 01-04-2008 at 09:52 PM.
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 10:58 PM   #7
John Ryan
Senior Member
 
John Ryan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
Posts: 497
Send a message via AIM to John Ryan
Default

Jim, I think there are several minor quibbles at work here.

1) I see dust spots. At least five of them.

2) I see lens vignetting. If you shoot RAW, you can correct this in the RAW conversion process. I'm guessing by the pattern of the vignetting that you cropped down from your original, if only slightly, and your crop focused on the right side of the original.

3) I see color noise. You can fix this by diddling around with the Replace Color tool.

Now, regarding the contrast: snow is usually very white, especially during full daylight. Everything else should fall into place. I think the strength of this shot lies in the starkness of the figures in and against the snow squall.



That said, I think it's an excellent shot of railroaders at work and it adds variety to the database.
John Ryan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 11:13 PM   #8
Ween
Senior Member
 
Ween's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,861
Default

Quote:
2) I see lens vignetting. If you shoot RAW, you can correct this in the RAW conversion process.
Well, you can also correct it with a JPEG/TIF easy enough in PS. Go Filters>Distort>Lens Correction and then slide the vignetting slider toward the right (I usally go +5 to 8.). I do this as a first step with the uncropped image.

The Sigma 17-70 usually has quite abit of vignetting, especially when near 17mm, and PS hasn't let me down yet...
__________________
Ween is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2008, 11:46 PM   #9
randy
Senior Member
 
randy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 144
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC
WHERE'S THE TRAIN????????????
I think they're looking for it!

This shot proves that you don't have to be nuts to railographer (trainographer?), but helps.

Nice shot, accepted or not.
__________________
Randy
randy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2008, 08:20 AM   #10
WembYard
Senior Member
 
WembYard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Bedfordshire, UK
Posts: 646
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by trainboysd40
I hate to say it, but there's something about this picture that I can't put my finger on.
My sentiments exactly.

Of the two pictures, I prefer the first one - the second version definitely does lack contrast, especially the rear three figures. Maybe try a re-work of version #1, keeping the contrast of the people but toning down the switchstand slightly? The red also looks a little "noisy".
WembYard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2008, 01:08 PM   #11
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,838
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Ryan
Jim, I think there are several minor quibbles at work here.

1) I see dust spots. At least five of them.
Actually, if it's what I think you're seeing, those spots are chunks of dark snow flying, and looking at a shot I took 3 seconds earlier, those same five spots aren't there. You're talking about the spots just below the guy on the right, correct? If so, they're borderline dust-spot-looking, so I suppose qualify for the cloning tool, and they really don't add anything to the scene.

Quote:
2) I see lens vignetting. If you shoot RAW, you can correct this in the RAW conversion process. I'm guessing by the pattern of the vignetting that you cropped down from your original, if only slightly, and your crop focused on the right side of the original.
Definitely RAW, and definitely correctable. That's something I overlooked before. However, vignetting is something I don't normally see at 320mm...so that effect MIGHT have been creating in my processing.


Quote:
3) I see color noise. You can fix this by diddling around with the Replace Color tool.
Didn't notice that before, but I'll keep an eye on it as I'm processing again.

Quote:
Now, regarding the contrast: snow is usually very white, especially during full daylight. Everything else should fall into place. I think the strength of this shot lies in the starkness of the figures in and against the snow squall.
With the first rejection, I was actually wondering if I made the snow squall look TOO white, especially compared to the first two pictures from the same day, with essentially the same exposure.


Quote:
That said, I think it's an excellent shot of railroaders at work and it adds variety to the database.
Thanks, John. I'll try another tweak and see what the results are.


Quote:
Originally Posted by WembYard
My sentiments exactly.

Of the two pictures, I prefer the first one - the second version definitely does lack contrast, especially the rear three figures. Maybe try a re-work of version #1, keeping the contrast of the people but toning down the switchstand slightly? The red also looks a little "noisy".
Thanks, Janet. The snow, mixed with a shallow depth of field, 400 ISO and my processing certainly contribute to the noise. I think I can control that, though.

Last edited by JimThias; 01-05-2008 at 01:10 PM.
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2008, 02:29 AM   #12
John Ryan
Senior Member
 
John Ryan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
Posts: 497
Send a message via AIM to John Ryan
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias
Actually, if it's what I think you're seeing, those spots are chunks of dark snow flying, and looking at a shot I took 3 seconds earlier, those same five spots aren't there. You're talking about the spots just below the guy on the right, correct? If so, they're borderline dust-spot-looking, so I suppose qualify for the cloning tool, and they really don't add anything to the scene.


Don't worry about the dust. I have to clean my camera daily, especially if I've been shooting basketball and I'm changing lenses on a dusty court floor. Dust is just a fact of life.
John Ryan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2008, 02:42 AM   #13
John Ryan
Senior Member
 
John Ryan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
Posts: 497
Send a message via AIM to John Ryan
Default

And for what it's worth, the technique of pushing contrast to the max usually works well when trying to spot other inconsistencies. I found this shot in the database and thought at the time that the sky looked rather strange. Ten seconds in Photoshop revealed enough cloning to remove an entire hot-air balloon festival. (And what it God's name needed to be dodged on either side of that pole in the background?)

John Ryan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2008, 04:23 PM   #14
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,838
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Ryan
[/IMG]

Don't worry about the dust. I have to clean my camera daily, especially if I've been shooting basketball and I'm changing lenses on a dusty court floor. Dust is just a fact of life.
Good eyes, John. I usually spend a little time inspecting the sky and solid areas for dust spots, but I completely overlooked those. I usually get 'em all, but sometimes a few slip through the cracks.

Oh well, unless the screener posts here and tells me which way to go with the contrast to make the shot look "right" to them, I'm not going to bother with it any more. It's one of those shots that you either like or dislike and can go either way with. No amount of tweaking is going to make it "right" for everyone.
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2008, 02:41 AM   #15
sd9
Senior Member
 
sd9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 799
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias
Good eyes, John. I usually spend a little time inspecting the sky and solid areas for dust spots, but I completely overlooked those. I usually get 'em all, but sometimes a few slip through the cracks.
wow that pic with all those yellow marks looks like a scene from one of those CSI shows
sd9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:02 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.