Old 05-03-2017, 01:27 PM   #1
DaveJ
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Default Unlevel ?

This was rejected for unlevel (leaning to the right).As it looks fine to me (and several other people that I showed it to),I'd be interested in others opinions -

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...48&key=4733283
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Old 05-03-2017, 01:31 PM   #2
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Does look to be leaning right a bit to me.
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Old 05-03-2017, 02:14 PM   #3
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A small amount of either vertical distortion correction, or a push on the bottom left corner in transform should fix it. *I don't believe that the entire image is unlevel, but rather it's a distortion issue from the lens / angle / focal length*.

* I'm at work eyeballing it, and do not have my normal photo editing equipment with me.

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Old 05-10-2017, 10:02 AM   #4
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It looks more level than this
Image © Steve Wilt
PhotoID: 615938
Photograph © Steve Wilt
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Old 05-10-2017, 01:36 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveJ View Post
This was rejected for unlevel (leaning to the right).As it looks fine to me (and several other people that I showed it to),I'd be interested in others opinions -

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...48&key=4733283
Depends on what you are leveling to but you cannot use the metal poles to level by since they are tapering poles. In PSE it is actually leaning left IF you use the buildings in the background. Its really screener preference at this point IMO. I'd try their suggestion, got nothing to lose.


Pic [615938] Is spot on with the only vertical part (the center white corner of the PDeck)of the pic.

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Old 05-10-2017, 02:45 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Grewup on the CW View Post
Depends on what you are leveling to but you cannot use the metal poles to level by since they are tapering poles. In PSE it is actually leaning left IF you use the buildings in the background. Its really screener preference at this point IMO. I'd try their suggestion, got nothing to lose.
I agree with Loyd that vertical distortion correction, possibly with a slight follow-up rotation, will correct this photo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grewup on the CW View Post
Pic [615938] Is spot on with the only vertical part (the center white corner of the PDeck)of the pic.
Every vertical in that photo, including the stair tower and all of the open "windows" of the parking deck leans left. Maybe your grid needs calibration.
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Old 05-10-2017, 03:40 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Decapod401 View Post
Every vertical in that photo, including the stair tower and all of the open "windows" of the parking deck leans left. Maybe your grid needs calibration.
Screen shot of pic in PSE, I still don't see your lean..........
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Old 05-10-2017, 04:45 PM   #8
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I think the lean was part of the problem?

Seriously, I drag a vertical guide across the image and all the vertical lines line up pretty close, that is the edges of the windows top to bottom, the edges of blocks, the edges of the staircase. The windows themselves are not square to the camera so would not appear level?.

That is my take, Anyway I think CW was on the forum before having problems getting some accepted, a good subject matter esp a wreck is a cure.

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Old 05-10-2017, 04:46 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Grewup on the CW View Post
Screen shot of pic in PSE, I still don't see your lean..........
I can't see your screen shot - not much more than a thumbnail.

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Rotated 0.5 degrees clockwise and recropped.
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Old 05-10-2017, 05:56 PM   #10
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[quote=Decapod401;191208]I can't see your screen shot - not much more than a thumbnail.

Sorry about the thumbnail Doug. I cannot figure how to put a better image on here. I can see a slight difference with your rotation of 0.5, minimal, but different. But if we are discussing vert on an object well in the distance (100+ yards), I think the argument is a mute point considering the foreground subject. Made me look several times so thanks for a different viewpoint.

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Old 05-10-2017, 06:12 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by RobJor View Post
I think the lean was part of the problem?

.... The windows themselves are not square to the camera so would not appear level?.

That is my take, Anyway I think CW was on the forum before having problems getting some accepted, a good subject matter esp a wreck is a cure.

Bob
Bob, Yes I am new to photography, only at it seriously for apprx 1.5 years. I am one who sits back and takes it all in and then when I 'Think" I have some sort of a handle on the task at hand, I start asking questions. Cant get better at something if you dont. I am on this forum to learn and not afraid to throw it out there to get different viewpoints. Thus why I commented on the vertical response. I believe the verticals in the background (PDeck) is the only thing you can orient to. The structure is going away from the focal point so all the horizontals would appear out of level. Agree?
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Old 05-10-2017, 06:17 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Grewup on the CW View Post
Sorry about the thumbnail Doug. I cannot figure how to put a better image on here. I can see a slight difference with your rotation of 0.5, minimal, but different. But if we are discussing vert on an object well in the distance (100+ yards), I think the argument is a mute point considering the foreground subject. Made me look several times so thanks for a different viewpoint.
Although the object is in the background, the building provides all of the vertical references. Unlevel is unlevel, and subject material does not usually mitigate this or other technical flaws in a photo, especially on RP. Occasionally, a screener will miss an unlevel image, but I've had many unlevel rejections for less obvious infractions.
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Old 05-10-2017, 06:31 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Decapod401 View Post
Although the object is in the background, the building provides all of the vertical references. Unlevel is unlevel, and subject material does not usually mitigate this or other technical flaws in a photo, especially on RP. Occasionally, a screener will miss an unlevel image, but I've had many unlevel rejections for less obvious infractions.
I wasnt trying to say the subject matter should out weigh a flaw, but merely saying the degree you mentioned is not worth a unlevel rejection.

So are you saying you have had unlevel rejections for less than 0.5?
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Old 05-10-2017, 06:35 PM   #14
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Edit: Never mind, I see I was late to the party. Hate it when threads that are no longer relevant (the O.P. issue was resolved) get revived - very confusing to my feeble old brain!
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Old 05-10-2017, 06:39 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grewup on the CW View Post
I believe the verticals in the background (PDeck) is the only thing you can orient to. The structure is going away from the focal point so all the horizontals would appear out of level. Agree?
Horizontals should not be used to determine level. As you have noted, they change with perspective.

What determines "level" is whether a reliable vertical reference in the center of the frame is truly vertical. Level horizon has nothing to due with whether or not the horizon, or any other "horizontal" runs flatly across the image. If all of your verticals (building corners, window frames, non-wooden poles that should be vertical) are not parallel from one edge of your frame to the other (mine never are), you are experiencing vertical lens distortion. This can be corrected in Photoshop or LightRoom. RP doesn't seem to be too concerned with it, but I prefer to correct vertical distortion. As an added benefit, it really helps in determining if an image is level by providing consistent vertical references.
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Old 05-10-2017, 06:43 PM   #16
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Quote:
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I wasnt trying to say the subject matter should out weigh a flaw, but merely saying the degree you mentioned is not worth a unlevel rejection.

So are you saying you have had unlevel rejections for less than 0.5?
Absolutely. And it's a simple matter to double check this before exporting the image.
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Old 05-10-2017, 07:00 PM   #17
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Absolutely. And its a simple matter to double check this before exporting the image.
Well I certainly do all the double checks and rechecks both from trail and error and these forums. I have had unlevel rejections before but never (at this point) had to adjust them under 1.0.
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Old 05-10-2017, 08:05 PM   #18
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Tiniest amount of vertical distortion applied (a very small amount) and voila - it's in.

Sorry,for some reason I can't link to the accepted picture - I've tried the usual way but just doesn't work.

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Old 05-10-2017, 08:41 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by DaveJ View Post
Tiniest amount of vertical distortion applied (a very small amount) and voila - it's in.

Sorry,for some reason I can't link to the accepted picture - I've tried the usual way but just doesn't work.
I tried and got "the message you have entered is too short"
Image © David J. Smith
PhotoID: 615598
Photograph © David J. Smith


But at least the link worked!
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Old 05-12-2017, 03:36 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by MassArt Images View Post
It looks more level than this
Image © Steve Wilt
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Photograph © Steve Wilt


I saw that and wanted to call it out here, but never got around to it. That was so obviously unlevel, I'm not sure how the screener missed it.
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Old 05-12-2017, 04:23 PM   #21
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I wonder what Jim has to say about this one?

Image © Kevin Burkholder
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Old 05-12-2017, 04:54 PM   #22
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I wonder what Jim has to say about this one?
Thias or Johnston?(Read Comments)
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Old 05-12-2017, 05:41 PM   #23
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Thias or Johnston?(Read Comments)
After comparing the two, apparently it was also underexposed.
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Old 05-12-2017, 05:53 PM   #24
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How dare all of you for attempting to slander the greatest railroad photographer ever!

Just kidding.. JJ's shot was fantastic. Burkholder's was a boff, with a lacking attempt to photoshop it into something useful, and missed the captain obvious in the level department.

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Old 05-12-2017, 07:44 PM   #25
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Kevin's also has the city misspelled, it is ShepHerdstown. Oddly, the only other person to have misspelled the city in that way is ... JJ! Who did so several times in 2006, presumably before he learned to add the "h".
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