Old 10-22-2006, 01:50 AM   #1
Dave Brook
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Default What is bad colour depth?

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreject.php?id=300136

New rejection type ( or my memory has failed again). What do I need to do with this one?

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Old 10-22-2006, 02:50 AM   #2
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It looks washed out, like a sign left in a grocer's window all summer. Maybe a little saturation would help. I am surprised it was rejected, being such a rare locomotive and over 20 years old now.
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Old 10-22-2006, 03:06 AM   #3
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I would suggest adding some more contrast and saturation.
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Old 10-22-2006, 03:35 AM   #4
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What Aaron said. The photo looks washed out, maybe even a little blurry above the coupler.

The bad color (colour) reject has been around for a while.

Last edited by Christopher Muller; 10-22-2006 at 02:42 PM.
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Old 10-22-2006, 12:30 PM   #5
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Default Bad Colour - Reworked

Good Morning Dave,

I just reworked your reject in PS:

Adjusted the black end of the histogram in levels, added 10 saturation, then sharpened 50 at 0.7 threshold zero.

I don't know if this is a rare loco or not (being a Brit) but the rework seems to have livened it up a bit.

Alan
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Old 10-22-2006, 03:16 PM   #6
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Hi Alan,

Nice re-work, but unless the orange is badly faded, it should be closer to the orange in Dave's Avatar image. I don't know if you can shift the color balance without throwing everything else off though!

Question. How would this shot have gotten that unsaturated in the first place?

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Old 10-22-2006, 03:28 PM   #7
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Part of my problem seems to stem from trying to clean up 20 year old slides. They seem to have faded abit, as well as dusting etc. I'l play with it again some more, but it may well be beyond salvage.

As for the unit, it was one of twenty, rode like a Cessna 150 in turbulence and smoked like a steamer. Ah, how I miss them from this side of the camera though..

Thanks for all the sdvice.

Cheers,

Dave
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Old 10-22-2006, 05:53 PM   #8
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Dave,

What scanner are you using? There are some programs out there that are designed to restore color in faded slides, plus digital ice does a pretty good job with dust. Use dust off anyway, but I find with digital ice, I only have to clone out a couple of dust spots, but even with a well cleaned slide, if I don't use digital ice I've got to clone out 30 or 40 dust specks.

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Old 10-22-2006, 06:48 PM   #9
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Here you go. Cropped evenly, smart sharpened in Photoshop, color correction, fixed contrast, bumped up saturation, small application of Neat Image for noise.

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Old 10-23-2006, 01:23 AM   #10
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Here's my version, having never seen one in real life I had to guess at the colour.

Cheers,

Christine.
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Old 10-23-2006, 02:58 AM   #11
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These are some fabulous results. The colour is a deep orange bordering on red. CN's trucks were called pumlins back then. They've gone to a more red hue now..when not covered with dirt.

I've got an Canon 4200F flat bed scanner. What is digital ice? I've got about 3000 old slides in various states of decay. All are in need of some kind of help after years of storage.

Thanks again,

Dave Brook
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Old 10-23-2006, 03:52 AM   #12
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Quote:
Digital ICE4 Advanced™ is an impressive suite of four image correction technologies. Digital ICE™ works with LED illumination to remove surface dust and scratches without altering image composition. Digital ROC™ automatically rebuilds and restores deteriorated color values for faithfully rendered images. Digital GEM™ reduces the effects of film grain, producing sharp, clear images without clumping or graininess. The newly added Digital DEE™ function uses exposure compensation to help reveal details that may be hidden in shadowy or highlighted portions of scenes.
Taken from:
http://www.nikon.ca/products/coolscanv/features/

Sorry it's Nikon and not Canon but I hope that it helps. I have a Nikon Coolscan and can recommend it if you are interested in a dedicated slide / negative scanner, all my pictures on RP taken before 2005 have been scanned using this.
Example
Image © Janet Cottrell
PhotoID: 159242
Photograph © Janet Cottrell


Before this I had a Minolta, which gave good results but I spent ages cloning dust spots and scratches off in Photoshop.
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Old 10-23-2006, 05:06 AM   #13
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Glad to see that it got in

Image © David L. Brook
PhotoID: 162723
Photograph © David L. Brook
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Old 10-23-2006, 05:37 AM   #14
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Dave,

If you have 3000 slides you want to scan, I would suggest that you get a dedicated slide scanner instead of using a flat bed. You will get much better results with a scanner designed for slides. Higher resolution, better color depth and no problems with Moire patterns and a lot less dust. Nikon is the best of the bunch at this point and they have models with street prices in the $400 range. I understand there are others models out there that are not much over $100.

The key thing is the digital ICE, GEM and ROC programs work during the scanning process, not afterwards, so they need to be integrated into the scanning software. Look for a scanner that includes them and you will be happy. I use a Minolta that scans at 5400 dpi, but seldom actually scan at more than 2700 dpi, since files get really big at 5400 dpi. Minolta is out of the digital business, having sold everything to Sony, but the scanner hasn't been re-released yet. Nikon has a couple of models that scan at 4000 dpi (more than enough) and everyone I have talked to who has one is very happy with it.

Alternatively, you could pick up an earlier model Nikon on eBay, probably for less than $200. Nikon scanners, starting with the LS-2000, came with digital ICE included and Nikon has upgrades available for their older scanners.

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Old 10-23-2006, 05:16 PM   #15
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Apparently, a shopping trip is in order. Thank you all for the information.

Cheers,
Dave
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Old 10-23-2006, 05:24 PM   #16
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You slide storage system troubles me, if you say that the slides are in DECAY, then you better rethink you means of storage. Slides should stay un faded for well over 20 years with no apparent loss of anything.

I think you belive the slides are in bad shape because your flatbed scanner is messing them up as you convert them. Defanetly get a slide scanner, it makes a world of differeance.

Havent tried the nikon product, but i have been using the Kronica Minolta Elite II 5400, it works very well, reproduction is almost exactly.
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Old 10-23-2006, 06:52 PM   #17
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Pat,

The only thing wrong with the Minolta is it's discontinued! I have one, I like it! It does make lots of weird noises while scanning though!

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Old 10-24-2006, 12:06 AM   #18
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Congrats! Nice to see it get in!

Image © David L. Brook
PhotoID: 162723
Photograph © David L. Brook


Quick question---- MLW...does that stand for Montreal Locomotive Works? Did they rebuild ALCos in order to keep them going?

Thanks,
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Old 10-24-2006, 01:14 AM   #19
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The storage hasn't been the big problem. It relates more to using "cheap " film when living on a high school budget, and projecting them on a casual enough basis that they see a lot of dust which, of course, magically bonds to the picture. I plan to put them on CD and store them that way. Hence, scanner shopping begins.
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Old 10-24-2006, 04:00 AM   #20
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IMO I think Rich's edit is a little more accurate. Nice shot of a nice loco, I'm glad it got in. Persistence and different opinions defintiely pay off here [sometimes].
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Old 10-24-2006, 05:01 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CG_F45
Quick question---- MLW...does that stand for Montreal Locomotive Works? Did they rebuild ALCos in order to keep them going?

Thanks,
Not too sure of the history but you are correct in the meaning of MLW. This plate is off CP (Portugal) #1564 which looks like this

Image © Janet Cottrell
PhotoID: 161650
Photograph © Janet Cottrell


I don't think that they rebuilt ALCos as such, more along the lines of took the company over and developed them. Using Portugal as an example, this is the earlier version of the above

Image © Ian Leech
PhotoID: 81671
Photograph © Ian Leech


which is a "real" ALCo (around 50 years old and some are still in use).
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Old 10-24-2006, 11:20 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CG_F45
Quick question---- MLW...does that stand for Montreal Locomotive Works? Did they rebuild ALCos in order to keep them going?

Thanks,
Cut and pasted from wikipedia;

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
After the termination of locomotive production in 1969, the locomotive designs (but not the engine development rights) were sold to the Montreal Locomotive Works, who continued their manufacture. The diesel engine business was sold to White Motor Corporation in 1970, who formed them into White Industrial Power. In 1977 White Industrial Power was sold to the British The General Electric Company plc (GEC) who renamed the unit Alco Power, Inc. The business was subsequently sold to the Fairbanks-Morse corporation, who continue to manufacture Alco-designed engines in addition to their own design.
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Old 10-24-2006, 11:38 PM   #23
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Ah, thanks for the info Janet and Frederick!
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