Old 04-28-2009, 04:08 PM   #1
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Default Processing cures.

I have been having trouble getting shots accepted to the database, and the main reason is processing. I use a D70 camera, and Picasa editing software.

In the past, I have always processed my photographs on the image quality fine or maximum, and from what others have suggested, that method isn't the best way.When I started out, I was processing using normal image quality, but that wasn't good enough.

Is it true that the best way to process is to use NEF(RAW)? I would like to continue on getting more shots accepted to the database. Did very well in Feb and some of March processing the camera on fine.

Here are my shots so far, accepted to the database. I know I can do better.

Thank you for comments.

http://www.railpictures.net/showphot...C1%7C%7C%7C%7C

http://www.railpictures.net/showphot...C1%7C%7C%7C%7C

http://www.railpictures.net/showphot...C1%7C%7C%7C%7C
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Old 04-28-2009, 04:43 PM   #2
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raw is a great thing but it isn't necessary for RP quality (although I personally use it and see no reason not to use it). I don't recall the exact threads of late with your shots but there are some simple principles to start out:

- shoot with the maximum resolution and image detail. This means either raw or it means jpg with the largest pixel dimensions available (3000x2000 instead of 2400*1600, say) and the least compression (the largest file size, Fine instead of Medium, that sort of thing)

- process properly. Never save a file and reopen a saved file (actually, one can do it to some extent but it is good practice to just not do it, it avoids degradation of image quality), always start with the original out-of-camera file, which you keep on your HD untouched. That is your negative, don't mess with it. Sharpen properly. Adjust exposure properly - look for a balanced histogram.

I'm not sure what you are looking for otherwise, but then I simply don't recall all the threads.

Remember that some things are not a matter of processing, like noses in shadow. (And remember that some things are RP preference and not photography dogma.)
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Old 04-28-2009, 09:13 PM   #3
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JRMDC,
Since January, I started shooting my photographs on the maximum resolution and image size. On my D70 camera, the maximum resolution is Fine, JPEG, fine that is.
From what others have said on the previous forums, especially the one started by me, "return of the rejections," I'm getting into trouble with processing, and I can kind of understand that.

I'm well aware of shadows on the noses of the train, are unnacceptable, in general, especially if it's a tree. I'm not just talking RP.
By negative, I'm sure you mean once the shot is fresh out of processing.
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Old 04-28-2009, 09:50 PM   #4
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By "negative" I am drawing an analogy to print film and I am saying never do anything to the original file coming out of the camera, always save to a new file.

But I can't really help you because I don't know what the problem is, especially given you have 31 in. Has something changed?

Is there any reason in particular why this issue is better served with a general query vs. a shot by shot consideration of rejections? It isn't clear to me that this thread in general is well founded.
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Old 04-29-2009, 03:14 AM   #5
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What would be an example of a balanced histogram?

I was just studying my D70 camera manual, and it appears that there are image optimization options, such as normal, sharp, vivid, custom, etc. Which would be the best for getting RP.net material shots?
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Old 04-29-2009, 04:02 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlev View Post
What would be an example of a balanced histogram?
Well, that is a complex topic and even the term "balanced," which I had just coined, is probably misleading. Honestly, you need to spend some time on the web or get a book. The histogram is a nice tool but it can't be explained in one or two sentences.

Quote:
I was just studying my D70 camera manual, and it appears that there are image optimization options, such as normal, sharp, vivid, custom, etc. Which would be the best for getting RP.net material shots?
In general, the more you let the camera (or computer) do automatically, the more problems you potentially run into (but when it works it is of course mighty convenient!). I can't comment on those sorts of settings specifically as I shoot raw and so they don't apply. Those are settings that affect how the camera creates the jpg. I can't speak for all of RP but I observe that the better photographers who participate in these forums all do as much of their own decision-making in post-processing as possible. So instead of choosing among those settings they make those decisions themselves in using their post-processing software.

I do come back to a question I asked before. It is great that you want to learn about post processing. An essential part of being an advanced hobbyist. But you do have shots accepted and I still wonder what changed so that you started having trouble.
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Old 04-29-2009, 10:55 AM   #7
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I don't really know 100 percent why I have been getting rejects lately? Maybe its because the sky might not always be of natural color. I set my ISO on 200 on sunny days, and NEVER go above that. Maybe, if its very sunny, I should start shooting on 100, and keep 200 for partly sunny or partly cloudy.

Maybe is even b/c the sun in the summer can be very strong. Most others on the forums probably say its my processing thats holding me back.

JRMDC, do you always keep your settings on RAW when you submit to RP.net?
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Old 04-29-2009, 04:47 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlev View Post
I don't really know 100 percent why I have been getting rejects lately? Maybe its because the sky might not always be of natural color. I set my ISO on 200 on sunny days, and NEVER go above that. Maybe, if its very sunny, I should start shooting on 100, and keep 200 for partly sunny or partly cloudy.

Maybe is even b/c the sun in the summer can be very strong. Most others on the forums probably say its my processing thats holding me back.

JRMDC, do you always keep your settings on RAW when you submit to RP.net?
If the choices are the sky, which everyone shoots with successfully, or your individual processing, I bet the issue is your processing.

I submit processed pictures, which originally were raw files. But that is not the issue, I have shots from a previous digicam that produced jpgs. The issue is processing.
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Old 04-29-2009, 09:15 PM   #9
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Part of me is saying I don't know if my rejection reasons are processing, especially if I have had 31 accepted so far. The majority of the 31 were in Jan, Feb, and March. I take my pics on the maximum setting and process them on the maximum setting.

To understand you correctly, JRMDC, when you take the shots, your image quality is on RAW, but when you process them, you put it on your maximum setting.
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Old 04-29-2009, 09:34 PM   #10
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Quote:
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To understand you correctly, JRMDC, when you take the shots, your image quality is on RAW, but when you process them, you put it on your maximum setting.
No, it is I who now understands you correctly. You have no idea as to the process or language of post-processing. No shame there, but you need to learn.

There is no such thing as a "maximum setting" for a processed shot, nor is there a single dimension of image quality.

A camera captures an image and produces a file to transfer to the computer. That file can capture information at various levels of quality, in various dimensions. Some levels of quality are uniformly good vs. bad, such as pixels and compression (3000x2000 vs 2400x1600 and Fine vs. Medium) and you want the best possible.

Some levels of quality are not so easily stated as good vs. bad, such as in-camera sharpening. There is a best level, an oversharpened level, an undersharpened level. How sharp you want it also depends on your intended use - do you want to put it onto the computer and do a lot with it, or just print it or email it right off the camera.

When you process a shot, you a) change the characteristics of the image, color, exposure, sharpness, etc., and you b) create a form of that shot suitable for the final purpose (printing, posting to RP, emailing). There is no such thing as a "maximum setting" in processing, there are many settings and not necessarily a "best" set of choices. There are tradeoffs.

Really, John, there is no shame in this, but it seems apparent to me that you would benefit from finding a good book and getting the full extent of the big picture and a lot of detail also, rather than trying to pick things up piecemeal in this forum.
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Old 04-29-2009, 11:38 PM   #11
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jlev
I thought I saw you post some where that you use Picasa to edit your photo's?

I use Picasa too and I can tell you what I do and that might help.
I shoot in RAW on my camera.

1. I down load the RAW files to my computer from the camera.
2. I opean up a RAW file in Picasa.
3. I then crop the photo the way I want it to be.
4. If it needs to be straighten I then do that.
5. Then I click on tunning and I play around with fill light, highlights, shadows, and color temperature until I get it the way I want it.
6. I then go to effects and then click on sharpen. I will play around with that until I get it the way I want it.
7. After all that I click on export.
8. On image size option I have marked resize to and I have that set at 1024.
Then on image qaulity I have it set on maximum. Then I just click ok to save it.
9. Then I upload to RP.

I should also note when I shot in jpg I did the same steps.

Also all my photo's I have here on RP was done this way.

I hope this helps!
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Old 04-29-2009, 11:46 PM   #12
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Wab1189, thank you.
In Jan, Feb, March, and April, I have been shooting on Fine. I had so much success in those four months, in general. I don't know what's happening to me. My processing, probably does need to be stepped up. I have never shot on RAW, and I think I will consider that.
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Old 04-29-2009, 11:59 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlev View Post
Wab1189, thank you.
In Jan, Feb, March, and April, I have been shooting on Fine. I had so much success in those four months, in general. I don't know what's happening to me. My processing, probably does need to be stepped up. I have never shot on RAW, and I think I will consider that.
I have a Pentax K110D for a camera and I started out shooting jpg. When I switched to RAW I could see a big change.

I would say if you had success before and now you are getting a bunch of rejects then it looks to me it is your processing.
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Old 04-30-2009, 12:56 AM   #14
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I remember when I started to send pictures to RP.net, my image quality was set to Normal, and I was having very poor success, wab1189. That was like last year.
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Old 05-02-2009, 01:59 AM   #15
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Default Processing work flow

Sorry, This was to be a new thread....

Last edited by A Siebold; 05-02-2009 at 02:03 AM. Reason: Thought I was beginning a new thread, sorry!
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Old 05-12-2009, 10:59 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wab1189 View Post
jlev
I thought I saw you post some where that you use Picasa to edit your photo's?

I use Picasa too and I can tell you what I do and that might help.
I shoot in RAW on my camera.

1. I down load the RAW files to my computer from the camera.
2. I opean up a RAW file in Picasa.
3. I then crop the photo the way I want it to be.
4. If it needs to be straighten I then do that.
5. Then I click on tunning and I play around with fill light, highlights, shadows, and color temperature until I get it the way I want it.
6. I then go to effects and then click on sharpen. I will play around with that until I get it the way I want it.
7. After all that I click on export.
8. On image size option I have marked resize to and I have that set at 1024.
Then on image qaulity I have it set on maximum. Then I just click ok to save it.
9. Then I upload to RP.

I should also note when I shot in jpg I did the same steps.

Also all my photo's I have here on RP was done this way.

I hope this helps!
If you could help me with getting this shot accepted. I shot this on RAW. I always keep this format in mind.
http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...d=683491&key=0
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Old 05-12-2009, 11:02 PM   #17
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If you still use your D70, send me the NEF file and I will work on it.
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Old 05-12-2009, 11:28 PM   #18
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Road Foreman, and others.
Here is another copy of the PL42AC and multilevel set attached. I know that I could get this in.

Last edited by jlev; 06-01-2009 at 12:54 AM.
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