Old 12-05-2011, 01:51 AM   #26
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Or maybe it simply isn't possible to have RP be everything to everybody. Given its role - I say valuable - in bringing the best wedgies on the net, and also its second rode in bringing interesting and even quite creative representational images to the web, at some point, perhaps it is time to say, well, maybe yet another layer, maybe that just makes the entire site too unworkable a mix. Especially if that work is less representational and more, for lack of a better term, aargh, "artistic" (not the first time words fail to describe an art, which is, after all, a non-verbal medium). Maybe that is the reality.
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Old 12-05-2011, 01:56 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by MagnumForce View Post
What is wrong with a wedgie and signal combo?
Nothing at all.

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The bad ones are the one in totally nondescript locations or ones that have fences and tripods in them.
100% agree.
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Old 12-05-2011, 01:58 AM   #28
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Its a flipping hobby shut the hell up.
It's a flipping discussion shut the hell up.

/Mitch
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:06 AM   #29
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The bad ones are the one in totally nondescript locations or ones that have fences and tripods in them.
Depends on the appeal of a totally nondescript location - and what and how you capture it - though, I get your point.

Wedges in nondescript locations:

Wedge #1:
Image © Mitch Goldman
PhotoID: 324904
Photograph © Mitch Goldman


Wedge #2:
Image © Mitch Goldman
PhotoID: 298518
Photograph © Mitch Goldman



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Old 12-05-2011, 02:08 AM   #30
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Its a flipping hobby shut the hell up.
Umm, NO! 'Cuz this is all about an attitude that really pisses me off!
And so I'll begin:
Why do people hate wedgies so? What’s so wrong with them, really? Short answer; ever since trains and photographers (or even painters) started getting together they found that the best way to put a very long subject in a frame was to look at it from an angle facing the locomotive. They also discovered an added bonus; it ended up being one of the most dramatic perspectives! The wedge showed the massiveness of the locomotive, and the diminishing size of the train as its consist receded in the distance emphasized the length. You had two powerful principals of composition in one shot, the diagonals and the converging lines. Compose it properly and it became the iconic shot, instantly recognizable and indeed almost synonymous with train photography. And therein, folks, lies the problem. Ponder this: I love Pearl Jam! My stepson says there’s a channel (station?) on his XM Satellite Radio that is all Pearl Jam, all day long. After a day or two of that I can guarantee you I would no longer love Pearl Jam. Does that mean they suck? Hell no, it just means I personally got sick of them due to simple overexposure. So the wedgie got overused, and then the wedgie syndrome begat another one; the anti-wedgie backlash. It became (as I have mentioned in the past) a popular bandwagon, and the weak of mind followers love to pile on it like lemmings headed for Nirvana Cliff! To quote from (as I recall) Mike L’s old signature: “I shoot wedgies! There, I said it!” I also shoot squares, circles, straight lines that don’t converge and/or are not diagonal, and a bunch of other stuff. I love what I do and I don’t pretend for an instant that I am an “artiste”. Indeed I friggin’ HATE “artistes”, I am disgusted to the core by them and their elitist attitudes. I’ve met so many in my decades on this earth (and continue to do so, no matter how hard I try to avoid their ilk) and it has only strengthened my resolve that the very vast majority of them are insolent turds, so vain and full of themselves. And yeah, if anybody thinks this song is about them it might very well be, although not intentionally on my part, just by default. I have no-one in particular in mind (aside from the unknown “expert photographer”) as I carry on my rant here! Well, maybe there is one name; Pablo Picasso. This guy looked at a drawing made by a crack-addicted baby, took a hit of acid to expand upon it and ended up with a dog’s breakfast (after the hurl) and made millions. The P.T. Barnum theorem proved. I’m not saying all abstractions hit me that way as I happen to be a great fan of some, so long as I can figure out what they’re trying to say to me. I’m just a simple kinda’ guy, but I’ll tell ya’, if somebody were to give me a free Picasso and a free Mikey Tuetel work I’d take the Mikey to hang on my wall and the Picasso to sell to some rich sucker (so long as they gave me top price)! I’m going to continue to shoot wedgies. I’m also going to continue to shoot circles, squares and all that other stuff. I’ll continue to submit all types and if the wedgies get accepted more than the other stuff, so be it. After all, most of my published stuff (that I can recall offhand) just happens to be of that genre. Doesn’t mean that they’re better, doesn’t mean that I like them any more. It only means that I really don’t give a flyin’ f*** what the elitists think, I just wanna have me some fun!
Cheers!
Wayne
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:09 AM   #31
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People, don't you know? Every time we take a wedgie shot, a real piece of railroad art dies somewhere.
LoL!!

Especially fitting this time of year...

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Old 12-05-2011, 02:14 AM   #32
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Umm, NO! 'Cuz...
Wow... that's the opposite of shut up! Take that Coborn, lol.

I'm gonna wait for the movie, Wayne, unless your comment
is available at Audible.com.

/Mitch
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:21 AM   #33
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Wow... that's the opposite of shut up! Take that Coborn, lol.

I'm gonna wait for the movie, Wayne, unless your comment
is available at Audible.com.

/Mitch
Oops, did I just say all that? Blame it on Alfred Lamb, I really didn't mean it... (or did I?)
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:28 AM   #34
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Railroad photography is some serious business.
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:29 AM   #35
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...
RailPictures has long striven to host the best rail photos on the internet. However, the glacier of mediocrity leaves little place for good rail photography. RailPictures faces the opportunity to exalt good photography, but will it?...
I'm trying to understand the point you're trying to make---but either I'm thick headed, or maybe you're not too clear on what it is yourself.

It's a little late for RP to trash 95 percent or more of its image base. For one thing, that would be incredibly stupid from a business standpoint. I have no idea what well known photographer you refer to (and I'm not going to insult that person), but it could be that he might overvalue his work. There are some excellent photographers out there who don't care a whit about RP---but their dismissal of this site as an appropriate venue for their work doesn't necessarily render RP a failure on the artistic train photo front.

Someone else might start a site that only caters to the truly "best" photography (a.k.a., very "creative" images----sunny wedgies are NOT welcome!). Fine and dandy---but I doubt it would gain much attention. People are kind of funny like that----a sizable percent of the populace doesn't always appreciate (or care for) "art." Lost in all this drivel is the truth that many people visit RP just because they enjoy good photos of trains. I think RP delivers on that front (notice I said "good"----not great, or best, or superb....just overall, good).

My argument has been for RP to be more inclusive of the more artistic images of trains. I think they've done much better at that of late. But, they could still do better. That debate is still undecided.

Forgive me if I misunderstood your points.
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:32 AM   #36
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Well, for me, part of the wedgie issue is aspirational. I really do think less of a shot that I could have taken, were I at the spot at that place at that time, then I do of one I would never have figured out was there for the taking, because I would never see it.

And part is appreciation. I do believe there is such a thing as "higher" vs. "lower" in art, however much we may disagree on what goes where. I tend to value down something that is done over and over vs. something that is done occasionally or rarely. A diamond is a diamond and a packing peanut is a packing peanut.

At the same time, I do click on wedgies. Often! I like CR, I like short freights where one can see both ends, I like spots I have been to, there are places I have interest in for reasons unknown, forgotten, or too trivial to matter. But that is a different form of entertainment. I read the comics every Sunday, cover to cover. (Of course, a lot of comics are really adult oriented anyway, but I digress ...)

So I can enjoy wedgies, and I am happier to see one correctly exposed and framed than not (thank you, RP screeners!). I shoot some, generally when I run out of ideas (often! ), sometimes because I do feel like it.

Basic wedgies are not wrong. But I only respect them, I do not admire them.
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Old 12-05-2011, 02:37 AM   #37
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Railroad photography is some serious business.
Indeed

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Old 12-05-2011, 03:18 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by wds View Post
Umm, NO! 'Cuz this is all about an attitude that really pisses me off!
And so I'll begin:
Why do people hate wedgies so? What’s so wrong with them, really? Short answer; ever since trains and photographers (or even painters) started getting together they found that the best way to put a very long subject in a frame was to look at it from an angle facing the locomotive. They also discovered an added bonus; it ended up being one of the most dramatic perspectives! The wedge showed the massiveness of the locomotive, and the diminishing size of the train as its consist receded in the distance emphasized the length. You had two powerful principals of composition in one shot, the diagonals and the converging lines. Compose it properly and it became the iconic shot, instantly recognizable and indeed almost synonymous with train photography. And therein, folks, lies the problem. Ponder this: I love Pearl Jam! My stepson says there’s a channel (station?) on his XM Satellite Radio that is all Pearl Jam, all day long. After a day or two of that I can guarantee you I would no longer love Pearl Jam. Does that mean they suck? Hell no, it just means I personally got sick of them due to simple overexposure. So the wedgie got overused, and then the wedgie syndrome begat another one; the anti-wedgie backlash. It became (as I have mentioned in the past) a popular bandwagon, and the weak of mind followers love to pile on it like lemmings headed for Nirvana Cliff! To quote from (as I recall) Mike L’s old signature: “I shoot wedgies! There, I said it!” I also shoot squares, circles, straight lines that don’t converge and/or are not diagonal, and a bunch of other stuff. I love what I do and I don’t pretend for an instant that I am an “artiste”. Indeed I friggin’ HATE “artistes”, I am disgusted to the core by them and their elitist attitudes. I’ve met so many in my decades on this earth (and continue to do so, no matter how hard I try to avoid their ilk) and it has only strengthened my resolve that the very vast majority of them are insolent turds, so vain and full of themselves. And yeah, if anybody thinks this song is about them it might very well be, although not intentionally on my part, just by default. I have no-one in particular in mind (aside from the unknown “expert photographer”) as I carry on my rant here! Well, maybe there is one name; Pablo Picasso. This guy looked at a drawing made by a crack-addicted baby, took a hit of acid to expand upon it and ended up with a dog’s breakfast (after the hurl) and made millions. The P.T. Barnum theorem proved. I’m not saying all abstractions hit me that way as I happen to be a great fan of some, so long as I can figure out what they’re trying to say to me. I’m just a simple kinda’ guy, but I’ll tell ya’, if somebody were to give me a free Picasso and a free Mikey Tuetel work I’d take the Mikey to hang on my wall and the Picasso to sell to some rich sucker (so long as they gave me top price)! I’m going to continue to shoot wedgies. I’m also going to continue to shoot circles, squares and all that other stuff. I’ll continue to submit all types and if the wedgies get accepted more than the other stuff, so be it. After all, most of my published stuff (that I can recall offhand) just happens to be of that genre. Doesn’t mean that they’re better, doesn’t mean that I like them any more. It only means that I really don’t give a flyin’ f*** what the elitists think, I just wanna have me some fun!
Cheers!
Wayne
Love this post. You do not have to flip off. I was refering to Peter though haha
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I personally have had a problem with those trying to tell us to turn railroad photography into an "art form." It's fine for them to do so, I welcome it in fact, but what I do have a problem with is that the practitioners of the more "arty" shots, I have found, tend to look down their nose's at others who are shooting more "mundane" shots.
Railroad photography is what you make of it, but one way is not "better" than another, IMHO. Unless you have a pole right thought the nose of the engine! -SG
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Old 12-05-2011, 03:25 AM   #39
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The site provides a home for photographers from all locations taking many kinds of photos to share their work, so long as it meets a fairly-well-defined level of proficiency.
Thank you, David. You've basically summed up the site's entire mission statement in one sentence. Bravo!

(Though, in retrospect, should that really be a surprise coming from the guy who authored what I consider to be the most ingenious two word photo caption of all time? )
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Old 12-05-2011, 03:44 AM   #40
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I don't even know who took the shot but I am guessing he had the infamous "Horsepower Droppings" photo?
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Old 12-05-2011, 05:37 AM   #41
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Thank you, David. You've basically summed up the site's entire mission statement in one sentence. Bravo!
Well, that was accomplished inadvertently, but you're welcome to use the sentence for the banner image on the new and improved RP site layout!

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I don't even know who took the shot but I am guessing he had the infamous "Horsepower Droppings" photo?
Yes, Brent, that be me.
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:03 PM   #42
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If your not going to give the photographer's name, explain this to me. The whole point of posting that was what?

I 2nd Loyd, lets see some of this "anonymous" person's work.

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Old 12-05-2011, 10:07 PM   #43
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Ian, I realized that. Therefore, I'll agree on this threads pointlessness.
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Old 12-07-2011, 12:18 AM   #44
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Exclamation DV Trolls the Forums

Daniel still has not learned to spell, or use the included spell check on FB.


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Another "Dibacle" by an RP member. Good judgement could have avoided a rejection.


Way to use what little brain cells that you have left after all that glue that you snort at lunch time in the back room at Dollar General.

Is that what happened to all of your ex-wives too Danny boy?

Weren't there like three of them?

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Old 12-07-2011, 01:27 AM   #45
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My favorite Dan quote lately...

Quote:
Bottom line: If RP did not make $$$ for Kilroy and Starnes, it would not exist.
Solid Gold...

And here I thought people went into business to LOSE money
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Old 12-07-2011, 01:47 AM   #46
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Exactly, Troy. It's called capitalism. The worst economic system, except for all of the others. Hence, the best.
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:21 AM   #47
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Clearly I'm all for more "creative" photography on RP....but being the devil's advocate....tell me how you justify rejecting a competently framed and exposed "wedge"? Some of the very best photographers in the world will show you one of their wedge shots as part of their best work.

So, I agree we need more expressive and edgy photographic work here---but at the expense of otherwise acceptable photography? This equates to throwing out the baby, the bathwater, and even the tub...
I think the problem is there are good and bad wedgies. There is nothing inherently wrong with wedgies, indeed many of the great railway pix are wedgies of some sort. But when the frame is filled with a technically compent and well lighted "common power" image and little else, or worse what foreground and back ground there is is equally uninteresting, then we have a boring wedgie....and a high percentage of RP shots.

The screeners either like those shots (or sense their audience likes them....after all this is a business based on traffic) or they have a difficult justifying the judgement call to reject them.
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:39 AM   #48
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Exclamation I am now one of the chosen few.

This is what I really like:

Apparently, I am one of the chosen few who has licked enough brown that I can get anything uploaded here.


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http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=383037

There are enough sunny day images of this locomotive on the database. Got cloud screwed?? Too bad. Cloudy day images as such are not good enough for RP.

El Roco is an RP troll, and that is why this image got approved. Screener playing favorites.

According to DV, a screener is playing favorites.....

Ya right - I don't feel the love.



Quote:
Originally Posted by troy12n View Post
My favorite Dan quote lately...

Quote:
Bottom line: If RP did not make $$$ for Kilroy and Starnes, it would not exist.

Solid Gold...

And here I thought people went into business to LOSE money
This is just more of Danny showing us in gruesome detail, and in his own words why he is a blithering idiot.



Quote:
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....[portion omitted]...The screeners either like those shots (or sense their audience likes them....after all this is a business based on traffic) or they have a difficult justifying the judgement call to reject them.
I think it is the classic slippery slope.

If they start rejecting wedgies as PEQ's then the system gets way too arbitrary and people might decide not to play.

One big thing about this is, that it requires new content on a daily basis.

No new content, no viewers.

No viewers, no add clicks (assuming people actually click on the adds) and then you have no revenue from adds and the Site starts to cost money.

Course, I speculate the Site already costs money, but what do I know.

Last edited by Holloran Grade; 12-07-2011 at 06:34 AM. Reason: Found another comment by Dan the Man.
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Old 12-07-2011, 03:27 PM   #49
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Default RE: Wedgies

Nevermind.

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Old 12-07-2011, 11:47 PM   #50
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People, don't you know? Every time we take a wedgie shot, a real piece of railroad art dies somewhere.
I thought that was when an angel gets their wings.................
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