Old 02-18-2009, 02:45 PM   #26
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What bugged me about it was that I was told in an email from an admin that open door shots with no sign of a crew change will more than likely to a rejection.

Point taken. I was not aware of the email.
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Old 02-18-2009, 03:41 PM   #27
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I don't think the newsworthiness has anything to do with it. That other shot just has a much smaller door, being further back, not so important to the image, whereas Wayne's shot (which I like and I would have accepted it) has it right up front.
Sorry, Wayne, but J hit the nail on the head, almost. Newsworthiness has a place for acceptance, like others have said, but the door is not as prominent in Sam's shot. Anyone can go out tomorrow and get a head-on shot of an NS C40 with the door closed.

Also, note the difference in angle. Sam's 3/4 angle allows a look at all the locomotives, which are a unique mix of GE widecabs, Geeps and switchers, while we really can't see the trailing units in your shot.

Lastly, you could have also gotten dinged for cropping, since you cut off the top of the trees above the middle of the bridge.

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Old 02-18-2009, 03:42 PM   #28
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Yea, the screeners like different shots. Why don't some of you get it? Lets say you have 2 shots and the train is too far away equally in both. Lets say one has a plain blue sky and dull foreground and the other has some clouds to fill the dead blue space, adds some texture and a little interest with a decent foreground. Well, one will be rejected and the other may not be rejected even though the train is way off in the distance the same in both.

The picture as a whole is being screened. If you have more plus's then minus's you get in. It isn't about if one part doesn't fit it gets rejected. If enough parts fit well, it makes it. All the fundamentals have to be right (color, exposure, contrast, level, etc.) and you can get it in but a very good composition, crop, and/or unique lighting can weigh heavy enough to overcome other flaws in the photo that are against rp's rules.
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Old 02-18-2009, 03:44 PM   #29
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Sorry, Wayne, but J hit the nail on the head, almost. Newsworthiness has a place for acceptance, like others have said, but the door is not as prominent in Sam's shot. Anyone can go out tomorrow and get a head-on shot of an NS C40 with the door closed.

Also, note the difference in angle. Sam's 3/4 angle allows a look at all the locomotives, which are a unique mix of GE widecabs, Geeps and switchers, while we really can't see the trailing units in your shot.

Lastly, you could have also gotten dinged for cropping, since you cut off the top of the trees above the middle of the bridge.

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Good points. This site is not black and white. There are gray areas.
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Old 02-18-2009, 06:08 PM   #30
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I definately agree, deadline/storage lines generate alot of traffic(no pun intended) and many people are interesting in seeing what engines and numbers are included. You always get the "I shot that UP 1892 last fall" sort of thing. I always click on storage shots just because they are showing the rail industry change (for the worse, I might add).

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Old 02-18-2009, 06:48 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by cblaz View Post
Sorry, Wayne, but J hit the nail on the head, almost. Newsworthiness has a place for acceptance, like others have said, but the door is not as prominent in Sam's shot. Anyone can go out tomorrow and get a head-on shot of an NS C40 with the door closed.

Also, note the difference in angle. Sam's 3/4 angle allows a look at all the locomotives, which are a unique mix of GE widecabs, Geeps and switchers, while we really can't see the trailing units in your shot.

Lastly, you could have also gotten dinged for cropping, since you cut off the top of the trees above the middle of the bridge.

- Chris
I guess I will keep in mind deadline newsworthy shots are always accepted... Well I know what I was told. What bothered me is what I was told, and then seeing the accepted shot. It really shows how inconsistent this site is at times. As far as my blood boiling? Not even close, its just a picture of a train, its like you said it can be re done any day. As it was, although not as nice in composition. I don't understand what you mean by cropping, I never have been hit for cropping by cutting the top of a tree off.
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Old 02-18-2009, 06:59 PM   #32
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I don't understand what you mean by cropping, I never have been hit for cropping by cutting the top of a tree off.
I believe it was a slight exaggeration to prove the point that one screener may focus on a door being open while another will first scan the "framing" of the shot to find any issues such as a wire intruding, a little white strip where it was rotated, or, if its been a very slow day, the tops of a treeline being cutoff throwing off the flow of the image. Of course, thats nitpicking the heck out of a shot, but some screeners may pick on a photographer or two so they improve. I know I've seen many "newbies" struggle through frustrating and seemingly pointless rejections (at the time) and then give the same little hints and tips to others first joining. Its kind of like the RP cycle of life.
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Old 02-18-2009, 07:27 PM   #33
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I guess I will keep in mind deadline newsworthy shots are always accepted... Well I know what I was told. What bothered me is what I was told, and then seeing the accepted shot. It really shows how inconsistent this site is at times.
Wayne, you keep missing the point. The open door is not the only reason your shot was rejected and Sam's was accepted. Your shot is a common, well-lit head-on shot of an NS C40-9W, of which there are 1,089 active, in active duty. If it was sunny today, I could go up to NS's Lehigh Line about 30 minutes from my house, wait a few hours for the right train, and recreate the exact scene, with the door closed.

Sam's shot, even though it is a widecab with the door open, is very different. For one, the following units, which, as I stated before, are hidden in your shot, are a very unique mix, not often seen together. Second, these engines are no longer active, so most, if not all of those units, may not move more than a few feet from this spot.

Yes, the doors are open on both units, but the photos are so drastically different, there is no comparison.

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Old 02-18-2009, 07:45 PM   #34
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Wayne, it's not that big a deal. Everyone here gets rejections and everyone can find an example of a shot similar to their reject that got in. IMHO, neither shot is all that interesting, nor did they require much skill or luck to obtain. The shot in question scored on the newsworthyness aspect... he had an edge.

All three of my recent submissions have been canned for various reasons. None are plain wedges, all are attempts at pushing my personal boundaries. I'm trying to only submit shots that get away the norm or "safe" submissions (with little luck, mind you), an attempt to provide more than just the average fare that my RP portfolio is full of. The screener didn't like them and that is that. I'm gonna try to re-edit one of them (an over-processed snow shot that can be corrected with time and effort), but the other two sunset shots I'm just forget about. I could find an example of a similar one that got in, but whats the point, and in the grand scheme of things, who cares?

And don't forget, do not PO the screeners or you'll get the dreaded 1 upload per day punishment
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Old 02-18-2009, 08:05 PM   #35
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Wayne, you keep missing the point. The open door is not the only reason your shot was rejected and Sam's was accepted. Your shot is a common, well-lit head-on shot of an NS C40-9W, of which there are 1,089 active, in active duty. If it was sunny today, I could go up to NS's Lehigh Line about 30 minutes from my house, wait a few hours for the right train, and recreate the exact scene, with the door closed.
Well, Chris, I can see why Wayne would be confused. His show is well-lit but it isn't the common head-on, it has a nice foreground focus / background blurred cars and bridge composition (do you have that track/car/bridge arrangement within 30 minutes of your house?). As far as I can tell the open door is in fact the only reason or the primary reason or the 98% reason why the shot was rejected.

Sam's shot has the factual interest, but Wayne's is the better composition. The nose-on works well here, with nice depth back to the cars, unlike a common nose-on shot without the contrast to a strong secondary element in the background.

Sam's is a dull wedgie. An interesting documentation shot, but a dull wedgie in terms of composition. I don't have a problem with Sam's getting in, I'm not big on the significance of a dead line sort of shot but there are lots of tastes and room for them. I do think that Wayne's shot should be accepted. But I in turn accept that RP's preferences regarding open doors are different from mine.

Wayne, let it go. Relatively in-your-face open door shots without crew present are not considered acceptable shots by RP. Distant open door shots of otherwise general decent quality are acceptable. Now you know, let it go.
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Old 02-18-2009, 08:22 PM   #36
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Relatively in-your-face open door shots without crew present are not considered acceptable shots by RP.
Quick, someone inform all the railfan hating engineers and other railroad workers out there so they can open all the nose doors on all their engines! That way, we won't be able to take any pictures to post on RP.

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Old 02-18-2009, 11:53 PM   #37
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I guess I will keep in mind deadline newsworthy shots are always accepted...
That was a joke, by the way.

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Wayne, you keep missing the point. The open door is not the only reason your shot was rejected and Sam's was accepted. Your shot is a common, well-lit head-on shot of an NS C40-9W, of which there are 1,089 active, in active duty. If it was sunny today, I could go up to NS's Lehigh Line about 30 minutes from my house, wait a few hours for the right train, and recreate the exact scene, with the door closed.

Sam's shot, even though it is a widecab with the door open, is very different. For one, the following units, which, as I stated before, are hidden in your shot, are a very unique mix, not often seen together. Second, these engines are no longer active, so most, if not all of those units, may not move more than a few feet from this spot.

Yes, the doors are open on both units, but the photos are so drastically different, there is no comparison.

- Chris
I wasn't comparing our shots, I just stated that the door was open. That was the only comparison I made. You seem, to not have read the rest of that post; just the first sentence.

Yes I did redo the shot, although for lack of interest the dispatcher decided to tie the train down on the siding for two hours. Both an inbound and outbound. So I ended up with this. I don't like the composition, the fact that its a GEVO instead of a Dash-9, but you can see the rest of the train itself.... and yes the door is closed.

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Well, Chris, I can see why Wayne would be confused. His show is well-lit but it isn't the common head-on, it has a nice foreground focus / background blurred cars and bridge composition (do you have that track/car/bridge arrangement within 30 minutes of your house?). As far as I can tell the open door is in fact the only reason or the primary reason or the 98% reason why the shot was rejected.

Sam's shot has the factual interest, but Wayne's is the better composition. The nose-on works well here, with nice depth back to the cars, unlike a common nose-on shot without the contrast to a strong secondary element in the background.

Sam's is a dull wedgie. An interesting documentation shot, but a dull wedgie in terms of composition. I don't have a problem with Sam's getting in, I'm not big on the significance of a dead line sort of shot but there are lots of tastes and room for them. I do think that Wayne's shot should be accepted. But I in turn accept that RP's preferences regarding open doors are different from mine.

Wayne, let it go. Relatively in-your-face open door shots without crew present are not considered acceptable shots by RP. Distant open door shots of otherwise general decent quality are acceptable. Now you know, let it go.
I have let it go, I was just stating my opinions about it. Going back to my rejected shot, I should have waited on the crew that is that. It is also apparently what the screener was thinking as well.

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Wayne, it's not that big a deal. Everyone here gets rejections and everyone can find an example of a shot similar to their reject that got in. IMHO, neither shot is all that interesting, nor did they require much skill or luck to obtain. The shot in question scored on the newsworthyness aspect... he had an edge.

All three of my recent submissions have been canned for various reasons. None are plain wedges, all are attempts at pushing my personal boundaries. I'm trying to only submit shots that get away the norm or "safe" submissions (with little luck, mind you), an attempt to provide more than just the average fare that my RP portfolio is full of. The screener didn't like them and that is that. I'm gonna try to re-edit one of them (an over-processed snow shot that can be corrected with time and effort), but the other two sunset shots I'm just forget about. I could find an example of a similar one that got in, but whats the point, and in the grand scheme of things, who cares?

And don't forget, do not PO the screeners or you'll get the dreaded 1 upload per day punishment
I am actually kind of surprised I haven't made one of them mad already, its good to have the RP Elite unlimited upload slot, I have always liked the challenge of getting a picture accepted on this site. Number 70 seemed almost like trying to obtain number 1 all over again. As I stated in a previous post I had to sit back and relax and just walk away for a couple of days find what I was doing wrong. For me I guess I try to be picky about what I shoot, not Mike B picky and not bothering to shoot a GE wide cab or a passenger train though. If I know I have good light somewhere I try to take advantage of it, and think about how the shot will look before the train gets there. That is why I usually like to upload images of where I have chased a train, and show it passing through different scenes.
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Old 02-19-2009, 08:29 PM   #38
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You are saying Travis takes pictures from a far distance, check this one out!

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphot...=3&favsearch=1

I personally like them all and not knocking them in anyway. I wish i had the opportunity to take shot like that, I might have more than 1 shot in the DB then!
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Old 02-19-2009, 10:16 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Andrew Blaszczyk (2) View Post
I believe it was a slight exaggeration to prove the point that one screener may focus on a door being open while another will first scan the "framing" of the shot to find any issues such as a wire intruding, a little white strip where it was rotated, or, if its been a very slow day, the tops of a treeline being cutoff throwing off the flow of the image. Of course, thats nitpicking the heck out of a shot, but some screeners may pick on a photographer or two so they improve. I know I've seen many "newbies" struggle through frustrating and seemingly pointless rejections (at the time) and then give the same little hints and tips to others first joining. Its kind of like the RP cycle of life.
I'm just tryin to not be at the bottom of the food chain in this "life cycle"
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Old 02-19-2009, 11:37 PM   #40
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Having edited an Australian rail magazine and having a website that has user submitted photos I can tell you that being an editor/screener is a tough job. My rule of thumb is that the older the photo is the more forgiving I am. Or if a photo is very newsy I forgive a lot too. Having said that I too have been perplexed by some of the photos I've had rejected.
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