Old 12-12-2018, 05:07 AM   #1
BUFFIE
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Default Appeal privelages lost - help

Hello fellow photogs and any admin that might hear my case

I had the following photo rejected due to leaning left. This bridge has a noticeable incline (up to the right) and I was going to appeal, pointing out that you can see from the center pilar and the I-beams on the left (and the parked truck) that the shot is actually level. Its the same incline that can be seen in these two photos.

Image © BUFFIE
PhotoID: 680064
Photograph © BUFFIE


Image © BUFFIE
PhotoID: 679848
Photograph © BUFFIE


Here is the rejected photo

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...93&key=2130336

BUT I was greeted by this message:

Your ability to appeal rejected photos at RailPictures.net has been removed due to abuse of the Appeal system, such
as appealing an unusually high percentage of your rejected photos.

I have had six photos rejected recently. On four photos I appealed and the images were accepted. Those included


Image © BUFFIE
PhotoID: 678092
Photograph © BUFFIE



Image © BUFFIE
PhotoID: 678067
Photograph © BUFFIE



Image © BUFFIE
PhotoID: 677584
Photograph © BUFFIE



Image © BUFFIE
PhotoID: 677409
Photograph © BUFFIE


Aside from the one noted above, the two others which were declined were

photo 1698063
Image ©
PhotoID:
Photograph ©
(the photo has since dropped out of my rejection box)

(My case was that the large poles actually drew the viewer's eye along the length of the train)

and

photo

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...73&key=2242716

(My case was that the fog was the intent of the photo and hopefully cloudy day would not apply)

So, if four of six rejects were accepted, I have a hard time understanding that I have been abusing the system.

Am I SOL or can perhaps a mod help me understand. I appreciate the site and have photos that I think others might like to see.

Cheers

BUFFIE

Last edited by BUFFIE; 12-12-2018 at 03:52 PM.
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Old 12-12-2018, 12:49 PM   #2
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Hot-linking rejections doesn't work. You'll need to copy / paste the rejection link instead.

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Old 12-12-2018, 01:14 PM   #3
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Appeal lost - welcome to the group. Honestly, I was probably a PIA so I can't complain too much. Part certainly is on me but I spent 30 years in business dealing with customers complaints so my sympathy of "complains too much" is limited. Many of our business improvements were bottom up, either from customers or employees, not top down from some owner genius. Every day in the media we seem to see another company problem related to misjudging customers.

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Image ©
PhotoID:
Photograph ©

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Old 12-12-2018, 02:57 PM   #4
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I have added the links to the rejected photos (the 2 that I have in my 'rejected' folder)

Not sure why the other photos have not shown up (the ones that were accepted after being rejected) as they are now in the data base.

Thanks
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Old 12-12-2018, 03:20 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUFFIE View Post
I have added the links to the rejected photos (the 2 that I have in my 'rejected' folder)

Not sure why the other photos have not shown up (the ones that were accepted after being rejected) as they are now in the data base.

Thanks
Not sure if I am looking at this correctly but the current highest photo number is in the 681,000 area and the photo numbers you are using are over 1 million.

Bob

Last edited by RobJor; 12-12-2018 at 04:11 PM.
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Old 12-12-2018, 03:47 PM   #6
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Thanks Bob - I fixed the links above (I was using the rejected photo number vs the actual data base photo number)
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Old 12-12-2018, 06:04 PM   #7
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If 4 of the 6 appeals resulted in the rejection being overturned, it's not an "abuse" of the system. Seems the only one abusing the system is the person hitting the rejection button on an image that was eventually deemed acceptable by the Admin.

That person should lose their ability to screen photos.
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Old 12-12-2018, 06:18 PM   #8
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Obviously, you are correct about the bridge incline.
The fog shot is not very "appealing" [] though.
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Old 12-12-2018, 06:33 PM   #9
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I'm pretty sure I've appealed less than 6 photos since I started here (in 2006).

You've got several of the bridge already on here, and the fog shot is a poor location choice, with some improvement needed on the edit.

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Old 12-12-2018, 08:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbassloyd View Post

You've got several of the bridge already on here, and the fog shot is a poor location choice, with some improvement needed on the edit.

Loyd L.
Yes valid point on the fog shot Loyd. With the rail bits I probably should have not even tried in the first place. But a cloudy day reject on a fog shot just didn't make sense.

On the bridge shot - how can one deny the opportunity to post a Warbonnet photo?



If the Warbonnet photo was indeed off kilter I would not have wanted to appeal.

I felt that the reasons for rejects on the four noted above did merit a valid appeal and those did get on.

Going forward I could promise to only appeal those shots where I can make a valid case.

For anyone that has been banned, is it 'for---e----ver'?
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Old 12-12-2018, 10:07 PM   #11
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For anyone that has been banned, is it 'for---e----ver'?
From what you've said, you haven't been banned or had your upload limit reduced. Rather, it sounds as if you somehow managed to exceed some threshold that resulted in your appeal privileges being revoked. You can still post your photos.

Question: Do you know how many shots you have attempted to upload in the last year and how many you have appealed? Often, we see threads started by folks who have lost one privilege or another, and the OPs make it sound as if they are victims of a heavy-handed Admin.....but when Admin chimes in with the rest of the story, we often find out there's a lot that the OP didn't tell us.

I think that in the last 10 years, I have appealed a grand total of 14 times, all but a couple of which were accepted. The most I ever appealed was in 2010 (4 times). The last time I appealed was in 2013. My approach is that I post the best of the keepers (vs. every last one of the keepers). If the site decides it does not want an image, I either try just once to fix it or move on to the next image. I have a Flickr site if someone wants to see the more run-of-the-mill stuff, or stuff that obviously doesn't conform to the RP rules.

Are the bans forever? I don't know from experience, but from what I read here, yeah, I think they are.
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Old 12-13-2018, 01:48 AM   #12
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Thanks for the reply Kevin

I would not mind if an Admin posts my stats - I suppose its only fair if I post the email I did.

I honestly don't think I have a large amount of rejects and I don't automatically appeal a reject - and specifically the odd PAQ or unlevel (when I truly missed the focal point for leveling). Maybe the stats say differently but I feel I am successful and over the last month or two can remember a handful of rejects. I don't keep the stats since I delete emails but will start tracking.

I tend to shoot shots that are less scenery based (although I have had fun lately chasing trains through the Castle Rock/Greenland/Palmer Lake areas) and more urban/close quarters based.

Of the four rejects that were noted above as being accepted on appeal, I believe 3 of the rejects were for 'rule of thirds/crop' which I just thought was a questionable reject. I also try to put forth a clear case for the appeal. In the case of BNSF 3160 I pointed out that intent was to showcase the extended cab unit (one of 5 such units). On the UP 4455 shot I noted that the extended coupler on the front dictated the crop submitted. On the snow shot the reject was for 'open door' which I felt was not a detriment to the photo - and honestly never noticed the door was cracked open when I submitted it.

As you can see from my profile stats I am not setting any high bars with my photos (one people's choice and one photo of the week - for the same photo no less). I do tend to photograph certain areas or subjects multiple times. If its a Bluebonnet, Warbonnet or BN Cascade Green unit I'll usually stop to shoot and try to post those because I see how fast those units are cycling through the paint shops and coming out in the H3 scheme. I also tend to shoot the BNSF Denver Yard and UP North Yard a lot because of the nice variety of engines that can be found and figure that many folks don't have access to such yards.

I have posted a lot of shots of the Denver Rock Island because when the City of Denver cranks up the $1B redevelopment of the Stockyards area, I'm not so sure that the DRIR will still be around. Most of their industrial clients are being bought out for high priced condos and urban office parks.

I will submit a photo of a previous area when I think the photo is an improved shot over one previously submitted or where I might be uploading a shot in the newer 1600 format vs the 1200 format of the previous photo.

In the case of the Larkspur Bridge, its just a cool bridge from multiple angles and if a Warbonnet is on it …. well then its a must post.

I truly appreciate being able to post the couple shots per day and spend quite a bit of time looking at and reading the other shots that are posted. I don't link my photos for the purpose of views and feel fortunate when a pic makes the Top Shots box. I also try to take the time to edit the photo and create the best crop I think looks right.

I still have a lot to learn about the camera and composition - but enjoy the chase of the train and selecting a couple to try to add to the data base.

Going forward I'll make the edit to reduce the incline and resubmit the Warbonnet. Its a moral imperative because....hey....its a Warbonnet.

And I'll try to see if I can go a month or two without a rejection.

Thanks for everyone's reply. Happy Foaming!
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Old 12-13-2018, 04:47 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbassloyd View Post
You've got several of the bridge already on here...
Personally, I don't think that the amount of prior photos at a location should have any bearing on rejection or even deciding what to submit. Yes I wouldn't post them back to back but over time I like seeing different trains at a location or different takes on a location.
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Old 12-13-2018, 05:10 AM   #14
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I can't appeal, mainly because I've been an asshole about my appeals, but on the other hand, I've been shooting for a little while, (1970) and have some vague idea of what to do with a camera. I've gotten rude and obnoxious with them when I think the rejection is BS. They don't like that, so now I can't appeal and I don't really care. If they accept what I post, fine, if they don't too bad. I won't give them any of my old stuff, because it's not worth the time and effort.
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Old 12-13-2018, 05:21 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Cermak View Post
Personally, I don't think that the amount of prior photos at a location should have any bearing on rejection or even deciding what to submit. Yes I wouldn't post them back to back but over time I like seeing different trains at a location or different takes on a location.
The comment was made in regard to appealing that many rejections. He has several shots from that location on here so why appeal the rejection for a similar photo?

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Old 12-13-2018, 05:28 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUFFIE View Post

On the bridge shot - how can one deny the opportunity to post a Warbonnet photo?

Easy, because it's not. #fakebonnet.

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Old 12-13-2018, 05:59 AM   #17
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LOL.

True Dat - but still close enough.
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Old 12-13-2018, 06:07 AM   #18
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http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...81&key=9332686

Now the old me would have wanted to appeal this shot because the cows were part of the intended scene.

The new me will accept and move on.

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Old 12-13-2018, 12:52 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUFFIE View Post
http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...81&key=9332686

Now the old me would have wanted to appeal this shot because the cows were part of the intended scene.

The new me will accept and move on.

Working interesting elements like cows into the scene is a good thing, but stretching the scene to include them, and thereby messing up the balance of the image, doesn't work. If you crop the right to include only three cows, this will probably be acceptable from a composition standpoint. You will need to change the aspect ratio to something like 4x5 to avoid clipping the top and bottom of the telegraph pole, which also is a bit of a distraction. While refraining from appealing, the new you will be well served to take a critical look at the rejected photos to understand why they could be improved. That thought process will keep you out of hot water and eventually increase your success ratio, which means the old you would have a lot less to appeal. There's no penalty with the screeners if you resubmit rejected photos with alterations to address the rejection reason. Continual complaining about their judgment in the form of excessive appeals will result in negative consequences. When resubmitting note what you have changed in the comments to screeners.
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Old 12-13-2018, 02:11 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Decapod401 View Post
Working interesting elements like cows into the scene is a good thing, but stretching the scene to include them, and thereby messing up the balance of the image, doesn't work. If you crop the right to include only three cows, this will probably be acceptable from a composition standpoint. You will need to change the aspect ration to something like 4x5 to avoid clipping the top and bottom of the telegraph pole, which also is a bit of a distraction. While refraining from appealing, the new you will be well served to take a critical look at the rejected photos to understand why they could be improved. That thought process will keep you out of hot water and eventually increase your success ratio, which means the old you would have a lot less to appeal. There's no penalty with the screeners if you resubmit rejected photos with alterations to address the rejection reason. Continual complaining about their judgment in the form of excessive appeals will result in negative consequences. When resubmitting note what you have changed in the comments to screeners.
I like the way you think.

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Old 12-13-2018, 03:12 PM   #21
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Thanks Doug - good advice.
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Old 12-13-2018, 03:24 PM   #22
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For anyone that has been banned, is it 'for---e----ver'?
Yep, pretty much. I lost the right to appeal maybe 3 years back, and justifiably. Still can't appeal at present.
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Old 12-13-2018, 03:39 PM   #23
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Quote:
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Working interesting elements like cows into the scene is a good thing, but stretching the scene to include them, and thereby messing up the balance of the image, doesn't work. If you crop the right to include only three cows, this will probably be acceptable from a composition standpoint. You will need to change the aspect ration to something like 4x5 to avoid clipping the top and bottom of the telegraph pole, which also is a bit of a distraction. While refraining from appealing, the new you will be well served to take a critical look at the rejected photos to understand why they could be improved. That thought process will keep you out of hot water and eventually increase your success ratio, which means the old you would have a lot less to appeal. There's no penalty with the screeners if you resubmit rejected photos with alterations to address the rejection reason. Continual complaining about their judgment in the form of excessive appeals will result in negative consequences. When resubmitting note what you have changed in the comments to screeners.
This has always been my approach to rejections. Really take the time to critically analyze your own work, then make adjustments and resubmit. We all like our own photos (otherwise we wouldn’t be posting them) but there are always ways we can improve and honest self reflection regarding feedback is key.
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Old 12-13-2018, 04:24 PM   #24
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Really take the time to critically analyze your own work
I agree fully! You should always be the harshest critic on your work. It also helps to have someone that can critique your work, and who isn't afraid to tell you something sucks when it does. You just don't get honest feedback via social media. Most users will lap piss from a mudhole and proclaim it to be champagne.

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Old 12-13-2018, 04:36 PM   #25
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I agree fully! You should always be the harshest critic on your work. It also helps to have someone that can critique your work, and who isn't afraid to tell you something sucks when it does. You just don't get honest feedback via social media. Most users will lap piss from a mudhole and proclaim it to be champagne.

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