Old 06-01-2009, 09:40 PM   #26
Andrew Blaszczyk (2)
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Originally Posted by kml928 View Post
How does cutting off 8 inches of the top cannon ball on the monument make it work? There is no reason to chop off top of the monument when it only took literally that much more space to fit it in. There is no way you can tell me that having that top chopped off looks good in that photo, this thread was more about that part of the photo than anything.

And actually to edit this, now that I look more at both I can understand why mine needs reshot and think his should be in the database, but not with that top chopped off the monument. I have been there numerous times, but this daily train only comes through between 10am and 1pm so there is no way to get this shot on a sunny day without at least having the train sidelit. I am sure thats why he chose the overcast day bc then the sun angle doesnt matter as much. But you only have to step back a few feet to get the rest of that monument in the top of the frame and even just raising the camera slightly would have got that part in.
Exactly. This is one of those times when adding a note to the screener saying this would be directly into the sun (as you know) on a sunny day. As for why I cut off the top of the monument it was for compositional purposes which you are obviously failing to comprehend. Its all about balance and leading the viewers eyes to what you want them to while keeping everything looking neat and orderly. *Some people could care less and are fine with objects all over the place in the frame. By leaving in those few inches I'm adding more dreary, uninteresting sky and throwing the dimensions of the photo off as well. I personally don't think this would work as a square which is also why I cut off some of the bottom. Well that and the road which I found distracting running across a small corner of the shot.

As for your vertical shot, I would have accepted it because I know that its impossible to get it to look good on a sunny day so maybe a note to the screener would help your case as well.
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:41 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by TheRoadForeman View Post
I see where this is going............

P.S. There are SEVERAL ways that anybody here can tell you that the "top chopped off" looks good in that photo! Example, it looks good with the top chopped off of the monument in Andrews photo!
Where this is going is there is a major element just cutoff at the top, I have had numerous rejections for the SAME thing.

I just dont understand how having half the cannon ball on the top of that image just cropped off doesnt make this shot bad cropping. But they will reject other photos for exactly the same thing.

You cant learn what a site wants when they are inconsistent in their screening.

BTW, heres one of mine that was nailed for bad cropping. There is maybe 6 inches of part of the building overhang not in the image and your telling me a chopped in half cannon ball which is much more a focal point of the piece is ok but this isnt?

My point here is not to knock someones photo, but try to get some consistent screening to learn more what this site wants before wasting time submitting photos.

Maybe this photo I just attached would have been a better comparison to start with.
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:44 PM   #28
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BTW, heres one of mine that was nailed for bad cropping. There is maybe 6 inches of part of the building overhang not in the image and your telling me a chopped in half cannon ball which is much more a focal point of the piece is ok but this isnt?
You also cut the flag in half. How un-American of you.

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Old 06-01-2009, 09:52 PM   #29
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You also cut the flag in half. How un-American of you.

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I can see its now time to just let this thread die now that the (no pun intended) reserves are here. Sorry for wasting everyones time, people are obviously taking offense where there is none meant. I am dropping this.
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:59 PM   #30
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"As for your vertical shot, I would have accepted it because I know that its impossible to get it to look good on a sunny day so maybe a note to the screener would help your case as well. "

Final response I promise. I submitted the CSX vertical shot with a note saying exactly that, and also appealed with another note saying the same thing. Both rejected for cloudy day / common power.

Would have been lucky to get you on that attempt, wish we could choose screeners that read the submission notes.
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Old 06-01-2009, 10:09 PM   #31
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I find Andrews photo, indeed most any photo he does, to have an outstandingly innate sense of composition.

His photo has a pleasing feel, it is balanced; my eye feels good looking at it. His work is usually done in a very simple, non-self conscious way a la Philip Hastings.

You and I would, most likely, include all the the monument in this shot. I admit, really looking at it cut off makes me think "that's odd, I wouldn't have done that." Probably the shot would be fine if the monument was all there. Probably it would be fine if less was there.

In my own work I tend to be too wide or too tight. I have fussed about cutting something off, backing up, up, up until you see it all and then I lose the point of the photo. Then I go in too tight and the subject has no breathing room.

So I'm still learning about this stuff in spite of making a living in photography all my life.

I figure if man of unquestioned talent does something in a certain, even debatable way, I have an opportunity to learn.
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Old 06-01-2009, 10:17 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by kml928 View Post
Where this is going is there is a major element just cutoff at the top, I have had numerous rejections for the SAME thing.

I just dont understand how having half the cannon ball on the top of that image just cropped off doesnt make this shot bad cropping. But they will reject other photos for exactly the same thing.

You cant learn what a site wants when they are inconsistent in their screening.

BTW, heres one of mine that was nailed for bad cropping. There is maybe 6 inches of part of the building overhang not in the image and your telling me a chopped in half cannon ball which is much more a focal point of the piece is ok but this isnt?

My point here is not to knock someones photo, but try to get some consistent screening to learn more what this site wants before wasting time submitting photos.

Maybe this photo I just attached would have been a better comparison to start with.
Sorry, I feel the writing on the monument is much more of a focal point than the cannonball in AB2's photo. I like the IDEA of your photo, but, it NEEDS better lighting. And to address your "Bad Cropping", the cut-off cannonball is not apart of the rule-of-thirds mix, the train and monument writing are. We could sit and write for days over screener consistancy or, lack there of but, they are only human and each one does have a different perspective of a good photo. It's just how it is.........
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Old 06-01-2009, 10:21 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by kml928 View Post
Where this is going is there is a major element just cutoff at the top, I have had numerous rejections for the SAME thing.

I just dont understand how having half the cannon ball on the top of that image just cropped off doesnt make this shot bad cropping. But they will reject other photos for exactly the same thing.

You cant learn what a site wants when they are inconsistent in their screening.

BTW, heres one of mine that was nailed for bad cropping. There is maybe 6 inches of part of the building overhang not in the image and your telling me a chopped in half cannon ball which is much more a focal point of the piece is ok but this isnt?

My point here is not to knock someones photo, but try to get some consistent screening to learn more what this site wants before wasting time submitting photos.

Maybe this photo I just attached would have been a better comparison to start with.
The difference between the cut-off monument in AB2's shot and your shot of the tower and train at Strasburg is whether or not the subject itself was cut-off. In AB2's shot, the subject is the the wording on the monument, not the entire monument. In your shot at Strasburg, the entire tower is clearly intended to be part of the shot (you'er not focused on the windows, or the door, and you're not showing just an eave). Thus, with a bit of the eave cut off, the shot feels as if we are missing something.

Hope that I explained that in a way that made sense.
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Old 06-01-2009, 10:42 PM   #34
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Personally I don't think it even a fair comparison. The shots are so different. Despite the monument being chopped off, it has really nice composition. If he had backed up enough to get the whole thing in I think the writing would be too small and the balance would be off. The only thing I would like to see different would be maybe tilt down just a touch more so the bottom corner wasn't cut-off but can't say even that bothers me that much. Besides the lighting, I can't find a nice balance with yours or a focal point since you included two monuments which don't seem to help the composition much. I actually think the shot could work if you cropped out the 2nd monument on the far left. It would help the balance.

As far as the other shot, Chris beat me to it, but the cut-off flag is as igregious if not more so than the cut-off eave, but truthfully unlike Andrew's shot, there is no clear reason as to why you cut-off those minor details on both sides other than the fact you couldn't back up enough to make it all fit.
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Old 06-01-2009, 10:42 PM   #35
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Fiddling around with it...

Andrews shot cut off more I think looks worse. (Can't try a full shot, no time for that kind of PS-ing!)

Keith, I think the two monuments make a discord so I cut one out and by using a bush helped cut off the rear of the train.

I rather like the shot now; it's not a conventional wedgie. I like the power of the train and the line of trees against the blue sky.

Of course RP wants the nose and truck lit but I think it is good this way. Maybe for a re-shoot on a rainy day?

Another idea would be to have the train "split" the two monuments.
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Old 06-01-2009, 10:56 PM   #36
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As far as screen consistency, anyone of us could be a screen for this web site or another -- meaning we'd be the only screener there -- and the screening process still would not be consistent. There's no way in such a subjective field.
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Old 06-01-2009, 11:05 PM   #37
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Besides the lighting, I can't find a nice balance with yours or a focal point since you included two monuments which don't seem to help the composition much. I actually think the shot could work if you cropped out the 2nd monument on the far left. It would help the balance.
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Dennis...Keith, I think the two monuments make a discord so I cut one out and by using a bush helped cut off the rear of the train.
Great minds think alike? Maybe I'm getting better at this.
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Old 06-01-2009, 11:17 PM   #38
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So you've had plenty of time to redo this shot with better lighting...why haven't you?
Actually, this line is notorious for having trains run against the sun. It is very difficult to get a train heading into the sun any time of the year because the scheduled times for the trains that run here do not favor it. That's part of the reason why I haven't gone down here (yet!).

For the record, I like the composition on Keith's shot better although I can't say I'm a huge fan of either one. I like the cloudy mood on AB's shot, but I'm not a fan of the cut off monument. I would have either brought a stepladder for elevation or used a wide angle shot. Andrew's shot is a good "train" photo, but for something like this I would rather include the whole monument and let the train have a somewhat more distant appearance.
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Old 06-02-2009, 12:29 AM   #39
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Great minds think alike? Maybe I'm getting better at this.
Certainly thinking alike...

Don't know nothing 'bout the geat part though!

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