Old 07-01-2009, 12:18 AM   #1
nwritchey
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Default Possible to correct "High Sun"?

Cuaght a crew out today starting to feed a coal burn for the upcoming weekend excursions, felt it to be my best RR photos yet, but still rejected for "High Sun/Poor Lighting". Is there anything I can do post process to correct this, or is this shot worth an appeal? Starting to think I am just not cut out to ever get a shot on here.
http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...d=703206&key=0

Thanks
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Old 07-01-2009, 12:32 AM   #2
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There isn't much sun on the front of the loco, it being black in colour makes it look even darker. I wouldn't appeal it.
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Old 07-01-2009, 01:21 AM   #3
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It's unlevel, cloudy, dark and a poor roster shot. Do you REALLY want that in your portfolio?

I know I wouldn't.
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Old 07-01-2009, 01:43 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by stevenmwelch View Post
It's unlevel, cloudy, dark and a poor roster shot. Do you REALLY want that in your portfolio?

I know I wouldn't.
I am appearently not you.

BTW you have a great attitude. Personally that statement, to me, makes you come across as a jerk. I posted on here looking for advise on how to, or if it was possible to improve said image, not for you to make a snide comment about how you would not want a picture in your portfolio. Oh well. I guess I just don't fit here. I know, no loss to you.
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Old 07-01-2009, 01:51 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nwritchey View Post
I am appearently not you.

BTW you have a great attitude. Personally that statement, to me, makes you come across as a jerk. I posted on here looking for advise on how to, or if it was possible to improve said image, not for you to make a snide comment about how you would not want a picture in your portfolio. Oh well. I guess I just don't fit here. I know, no loss to you.
It's called constructive criticism, everyone hears it, if your looking for advice snapping back with a remark like that is no way to go. I find myself agreeing with Steven, the light is flat and dull; not really high sun but the light is a big turn off.

The only fix for high sun though is to shoot in the mornings 7-10 and 3:30-dark(in my area that is). Which leaves out most of the day unfortunately.
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Old 07-01-2009, 02:17 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by nwritchey View Post
I posted on here looking for advise on how to, or if it was possible to improve said image, not for you to make a snide comment about how you would not want a picture in your portfolio.
Looking through your photos on Flickr it seems like you have just started out, when I look at my photos when I started out (back in 2005) I now realise how dodgy they look to what I consider 'good' today.
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Old 07-01-2009, 02:47 AM   #7
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Hi Nathaniel,

I'm guessing that the Screener hit the "High Sun" button because he wasn't crazy about the lighting and because "Cloudy Day - Common Power" doesn't really apply here. Two things:
  1. This is not a classic "High Sun" shot. As others have noted, the high sun angles during the mid-day hours in the summer make for indirect lighting of the subject, rendering the colors poorly and leaving lots of dark shadows, particularly around the running gear. That's not exactly what you have here.
  2. This is not a terrible shot by any means. The lighting isn't great, but it is not terrible and the exposure is pretty good for the conditions. Look at other rejected shots you'll see posted here on the forum and this is closer to the mark than many.

What you have here is a cloudy day shot with a less-than-interesting angle. Neither circumstance by itself is that bad, but the combination makes it tough to get into RP. Cloudy is only a death sentence if you are shooting common, everyday "diseasels" (did I say that aloud? ). Cloudy can work with vintage equipment like this steam engine, especially when the consist appears to be brightly colored and you have some nice, green foliage. The key is that you need a more interesting angle....this one is perhaps a bit too nose-on. If you have something from a few steps to the left, where you can see more of the train and the running gear on the engine, that would probably have a better chance.

I would not "appeal" this version. If you're really hard-over to get this in, I would start over and play with brightness, contrast, shadows and highlights. If you have Photoshop Elements, try messing with "Smart Fix". You can (and should) brighten this up a bit and you can do it without ruining it. When you resubmit, be sure to write a note to the Screener briefly explaining what you did. If the brighter version gets rejected, then you can appeal if you want. Just be careful. If you've appealed before, beware that too many appeals can get you in dutch with the Admins.

And oh by the way, don't let the High Sun rejection stop you from trying mid-day shots. Sure, most of them will end up in the bit bucket, but once in a while, the sky condition, the light angle and the subject come together for a real gem. Here's one that I shot in Strasburg at 1PM in August:

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Old 07-01-2009, 03:23 AM   #8
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Hi Nathaniel,

The key is that you need a more interesting angle....this one is perhaps a bit too nose-on. If you have something from a few steps to the left, where you can see more of the train and the running gear on the engine, that would probably have a better chance.
Kevin,

Thanks!

That is what I would call constructive. Would this shot work out better?
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Old 07-01-2009, 03:27 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by nwritchey View Post
Cuaght a crew out today starting to feed a coal burn for the upcoming weekend excursions, felt it to be my best RR photos yet, but still rejected for "High Sun/Poor Lighting". Is there anything I can do post process to correct this, or is this shot worth an appeal? Starting to think I am just not cut out to ever get a shot on here.
http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...d=703206&key=0

Thanks
Oh, my god!

RP have been rejected your photo because of "high sun" but no sun there lol

- David
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Old 07-01-2009, 03:38 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by nwritchey View Post
Kevin,

Thanks!

That is what I would call constructive. Would this shot work out better?
It's the same lighting cloudy and flat, maybe a little more sun. The composition and angle is a lot better than the shot you submitted.
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Old 07-01-2009, 03:46 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by nwritchey View Post
Kevin,

Thanks!

That is what I would call constructive. Would this shot work out better?
Hi Nathaniel,

Definitely a better angle. Lighting on most of the scene isn't too too bad. The only issue I see is the running gear and trucks. They are pretty dark...like what you would see in a high sun situation. Marginal at best for RP. Even though it is cloudy, the sun angle still can matter. The other side of the train looks brighter. Where is the sun in this shot? What time of day is it? Do you have any shots from the other side. Even on a bright cloudy day, you'll want the sun at your back if possible.
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Old 07-01-2009, 03:49 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by stevenmwelch View Post
It's unlevel, cloudy, dark and a poor roster shot. Do you REALLY want that in your portfolio?

I know I wouldn't.
Apparently you didn't "sugar coat" this enough Steven...
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Old 07-01-2009, 04:15 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nwritchey View Post
I am appearently not you.

BTW you have a great attitude. Personally that statement, to me, makes you come across as a jerk. I posted on here looking for advise on how to, or if it was possible to improve said image, not for you to make a snide comment about how you would not want a picture in your portfolio. Oh well. I guess I just don't fit here. I know, no loss to you.

I see no issue with Steven's comment, at all. You asked, he told. It wasn't a snide comment at all. If anything, he's helping with the portfolio comment. We all want to see GREAT photographs here, not high sun, contrasty, cloudy, shots. Yea, we all take them, but we don't post them here then wonder why they don't get on, then come to the forums saying quote, "Starting to think I am just not cut out to ever get a shot on here." Now who here started the snide comment? That sort of attitude is what gets US going with the comments we come back with. Again, to everyone who has the mindset, RP is not out to get you and you're not being singled out. Get over it, try again, and again, and again. Follow the advice we give, follow the shots that have been accepted and duplicate the results without copying the image. Good luck.

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Old 07-01-2009, 04:22 AM   #14
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If you want some relevant comments on the shot so I don't get flamed, the shot is just dark overall. It really doesn't look high sun at all, it looks just overcast. Even with hours of processing it to make it look just "ok", it's not RP material. You need to level it also. Contrast is pretty bad, honestly. These are things you need to go over before you submit. It just looks like you need to spend more time when you process instead of snapping the shot, sharpen it a bit and crop it a bit then resize and submit. You won't get great results with that method.

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Old 07-01-2009, 04:30 AM   #15
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I would like to applogize for my frustration earlier and would also like to say thanks to all that have commented to this thread. I finally got one on. http://www.railpictures.net/viewphot...=289181&nseq=1
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Old 07-01-2009, 11:44 AM   #16
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Congratulations Nathaniel! For a lot of folks, that's a tough hump to get over.

Now, you need to plan to shoot in light that gives you the best chance for good photographs. Shoot a lot of pictures with different angles. Learn your camera's histogram to get optimum exposures. Be discriminating in selecting ones that you want to upload here. Postprocess them to the best of your ability. If you aren't sure about whether or not a shot will fly, post it here and get some comments before you send it to the Screeners.

A word about comments..... You need to have a thick skin. When you put your work in front of the general public, you'll get all kinds of comments. The criticism you get won't always be constructive or tactful. Those skills are just as difficult to learn as good photography. Above all, be patient. Anything worth aspiring to is worth waiting for.
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